Author Topic: YOU are Satan...  (Read 33763 times)

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Offline sparrow

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #350 on: July 17, 2009, 08:36:48 AM »
 :thewife: Seth!!!
 :thewife:  Willie!!!

knock it off now.

I love you both.

yes, I know....
we all have our arguments about stuff.
but do it with love.

We're all on our own path that God put us on, right?
We don't need to PROVE we're right or the other person is wrong.
Just SHARE.

ok?

and Willie... now, you know I love ya... but come on give a brother a break. Just let him share without y'know... jumping on him. We're all God's children. And we ALL see through the glass darkly. We will ALL one day understand things so much better, and we will all learn, and perhaps have some of our beliefs STAY and some of our beliefs FALL AWAY. In time.

just love you guys, that's all.
and I'm glad to see Seth back on the forum.
And Willie... I always love reading your posts.

so... as your sister, can't ya'll kinda chill out a little on each other?
dangit.
:thewife:  <----look, my poor little arm is getting tired.  Look at that little stick arm, and that giant rolling pin. That little arm has NO muscle at all, how in the heck am I even holding that thing up????

thanks guys.
love,
sparrow

p.s. for future reference, anyone here can toss rolling pins at me if I'm need of it, too.
ok? I say this as a reminder for MYSELF as well, guys...

 :HeartThrob:  :HeartThrob:  :HeartThrob:



"I knelt to drink,
And knew that I was on the brink
Of endless joy. And everywhere
I turned I saw a wonder there."

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Offline jabcat

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #351 on: July 17, 2009, 08:48:15 AM »
...we ALL see through the glass darkly. We will ALL one day understand things so much better, and we will all learn, and perhaps have some of our beliefs STAY and some of our beliefs FALL AWAY. In time.

 :HeartThrob:  :HeartThrob:  :HeartThrob:

Right on!   Good reminder to me/us all!   Amen.  :2thumbs:

Sometimes I want to argue, and God's spoken to me about that recently.  Sometimes I state things as if I really know them instead of "this is what I see right now, and God may show me more clearly later on".  I agree Sparrow, we all see through a glass darkly.  Sometimes we act as if that only applies to the other guy  :icon_rr:.  I told a fella the other day that if we run across someone that acts like they've got it all figured out, be suspicious (so he immediately became suspicious of me :laughing7:). 

Thanks again for reminding me.  Your brother, James (the lesser). 
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 09:37:04 AM by jabcat »

SPOKENFOR

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #352 on: July 17, 2009, 11:55:56 AM »
Me too Sparrow, same thing he is dealing with me about lately..

trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #353 on: July 17, 2009, 04:36:24 PM »
I must say that this was the most civil discussion on satan I have read. You all were very kind and undemeaning in your responses. You all have provoked some thought within myself regarding sin.

Are evil thoughts sin? If I get Seth, he seems to think so. You make a good argument, but it doesn't feel right in my spirit that evil thoughts are sin. I am reminded of the old adage: Birds may fly overhead, but don't let them make a nest.

I am wondering if the birds flying overhead are just thoughts of good and evil. We are human, we have an intellectual brain and these thoughts they come and go. When I go to the store with my child I am careful to watch my child as I know all manner of evil that a pedafile could do. Is it a sin that I can think of the evil that can be done to my child? If Jesus' body was hungry was it evil that his mind knew he could turn the rocks into bread? Was it evil that he knew he could rule the world? Was it evil that he knew angles would bear him up if he ended his misery? Having knowledge isn't evil, it is the foothold it grabs onto in the flesh. Fortunately this knowledge didn't have a foothold because Jesus' mind was in the spirit. Jesus knew these things would end the suffering in his flesh, but didn't entertain them his mind was in the spirit.

If we have evil thoughts, are they lustful automatically because we thought them or can they just be knowledge that presents itself?

Hi Sarah, God's Word answers your question here:

Jas 1:15  Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
Jas 1:16  Do not err, my beloved brethren.

Lust can bring forth sin.  So this means the initial thought of evil is NOT sin.  Here is part of Gill's commentary on these verses which I thought reflects it more:

Quote
Jas 1:15  Then when lust hath conceived,.... A proposal of pleasure or profit being made, agreeable to lust, or the principle of corrupt nature, sinful man is pleased with it; and instead of resisting and rejecting the motion made, he admits of it, and receives it, and cherishes it in his mind; he dallies and plays with it; he dwells upon it in his thoughts, and hides it under his tongue, and in his heart, as a sweet morsel, and forsakes it not, but contrives ways and means how to bring it about; and this is lust's conceiving. The figure is used in Psa_7:14 on which Kimchi, a Jewish commentator, has this note;

"he (the psalmist) compares the thoughts of the heart להריון, "to a conception", and when they go out in word, this is "travail", and in work or act, this is "bringing forth"."

And so it follows here,

it bringeth forth sin; into act, not only by consenting to it, but by performing it:

and sin, when it is finished: being solicited, is agreed to, and actually committed:

bringeth forth death; as the first sin of man brought death into the world, brought a spiritual death, or moral death upon man, subjected him to a corporeal death, and made him liable to an eternal one; so every sin is deserving of death, death is the just wages of it; yea, even the motions of sin work in men to bring forth fruit unto death. Something like these several gradual steps, in which sin proceeds, is observed by the Jews, and expressed in much the like language, in allegorizing the case of Lot, and his two daughters (i);

"the concupiscent soul (or "lust") stirs up the evil figment, and imagines by it, and it cleaves to every evil imagination, שמתעברת, "until it conceives a little", and produces in the heart of man the evil thought, and cleaves to it; and as yet it is in his heart, and is not "finished" to do it, until this desire or lust stirs up the strength of the body, first to cleave to the evil figment, and then תשלום הרעה, "sin is finished"; as it is said, Gen_19:36."

Paul



aspiring son

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #354 on: July 17, 2009, 04:38:59 PM »
This is not applied to willie or seth, but going along with what jabcat and sparrow is saying.

People are going to be afraid to ask questions and share their points of view if the authority attitude of knowing "all" is what they're going to get. People want answers, but they want to know that they are not the only one's with hard questions about our Father. Most of us have been through a lot to be where we are now. The babylonian church systems, false teachings that seem to be burned in our minds, loss of fellowship, etc. I think for the most part we do a good job of nurturing people hear. But it's definitely something we need to stay diligent in. Let's just make this a reminder of that.

Grace and peace,

Brandon

trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #355 on: July 17, 2009, 04:43:04 PM »
Maybe His soul desired but His Spirit overcame and that reconciled things.

That is exactly what happened.  Jesus overcame the evil desires that originated in His own Flesh so that they didn't "BRING FORTH" sin.

Paul

Offline Cardinal

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #356 on: July 17, 2009, 05:19:29 PM »
 :cloud9: The idea that He didn't originates within the RCC belief that He was BORN 100% divine, which means that we couldn't possibly do what He did, yet it says that we will do greater works.

He was taught of Father thru the HS he received, just as we are. Only difference is He received His at birth, because Father had to show with a TYPE AND SHADOW BORN UNDER THE LAW, what was to happen to us with the new birth, ie. our soul/womb receives the Spirit/Seed and will eventually birth the Son of promise, rending the veil (amniotic bag) that HE might be seen. Blessings....
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 07:48:52 PM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #357 on: July 17, 2009, 05:37:55 PM »
Jesus learned things.

Heb 5:8  Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;

Notice He had to learn OBEDIENCE.  Obedience would mean the ABILITY to NOT sin.  So if Jesus couldn't think evil thoughts as some here believe then it would mean that He NEVER LACKED ability.

Paul

Offline Seth

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #358 on: July 17, 2009, 06:46:28 PM »
:thewife: Seth!!!
 :thewife:  Willie!!!

knock it off now.

I love you both.

yes, I know....
we all have our arguments about stuff.
but do it with love.

Sparrow, you are right.

I apologize to the forum for my reaction to WillieH's words. Had he not invoked Craig, I probably would not have responded, or just said "ok we disagree, thanks for the convo." But when he used Craig to jab at me, it hurt, but not for me, I hurt for Craig. He had issues that he even expressed he was working on etc etc. But when WillieH said that, it just reminded me how much I wish Craig the best and I hope he is happier now and in a better place in life, in his emotions etc.

To me, it was just not right to bring someone's name into the conversation when he is not here. That is just gossip and hurtful to him. It was just slanderous and could serve to turn people against Craig who either don't know him or haven't met him. That was just low to me.

But I apologize for my reaction. I reacted to that in the moment and I shouldn't have contributed to the spirit that it created.
 :HeartThrob:


Offline Seth

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #359 on: July 17, 2009, 07:02:11 PM »
Maybe His soul desired but His Spirit overcame and that reconciled things.

That is exactly what happened.  Jesus overcame the evil desires that originated in His own Flesh so that they didn't "BRING FORTH" sin.

Paul

Hi Paul, I have enjoyed your writing, and believe that you can speak on these things civilly. I have actually really enjoyed reading your writing in the Works thread. So I look forward to discussing this with you.  :HeartThrob:

Paul evil desires originate from SIN in the flesh, not just "the flesh." The flesh itself is SINFUL in that sin is IN it. Now Jesus came in the likeness of sinful flesh. If you believe that such a thing means that he had sinful flesh (not just the representation of it), that he had sin in his members, that's fine. It doesn't really matter.

What matters most as represented in Romans 7 is, where was his MIND at. Is evil desire able to penetrate a PERFECTLY spiritual mind? Paul reveals that evil desires are put to death the more our minds are spiritual. Now, as stated, Jesus Christ was without SIN. Which means He was without sin to BRING FORTH. What Apostle Paul is showing us is that when we are CLOTHED with flesh, and have the Holy Spirit, it becomes our intercessor between the body and the mind. The Spirit CRUCIFIES the flesh with all it's what? AFFECTIONS AND LUSTS.

So we need to simply ask ourselves:

1) Was Jesus clothed with flesh? Yes.
2) Do evil desires (lust) originate according to the sin in the flesh? Yes.
3) But did Jesus have the Spirit without measure? Yes.
4) Was he not in the flesh but in the spirit, since he had the fulness of God in him? Yes.
5) THEREFORE WAS HIS FLESH CRUCIFIED WITH ALL ITS AFFECTIONS AND LUSTS? Yes.

That is why Christ being without sin means he didn't have evil desires, because then his mind would be at war, if he had a CARNAL mind. Having a SPIRITUAL mind means that the lusts created by the flesh are put to death with the body.

You asked: then why did Jesus come in the flesh? My answer: to be the VISIBLE IMAGE of THE INVISIBLE GOD. Jesus christ is the VISIBLE IMAGE of a PURELY SPIRITUAL MIND. Jesus Christ, while clothed in flesh was a picture of GOD HIMSELF. That God knows evil does not mean that GOD, our Father, has lustful desires. God cannot be tempted with sin. Jesus Christ was his very VISUAL IMAGE. That is the point of him coming in the flesh yet having a purely spiritual mind.

Jesus Christ is the picture of our goal. Clothed in flesh, however he says: If you have seen me you have seen the Father.

That's really bold.


Quote
Notice He had to learn OBEDIENCE.

I talked about this but it bears repeating. Learning is simply gaining information. When I learned that 1+1=2 does not mean that I thought CONTRARY to that before. I simply had no opinion. One can learn from a place of neutrality. Jesus did not have to be disobedient in order to grow in obedience.


« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 07:16:58 PM by Seth »

trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #360 on: July 17, 2009, 07:15:07 PM »
Jesus took on sinful flesh:

Rom 8:3  For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

If Jesus flesh was not of the ability to sin then He wasn't given sinful flesh.  Additionally, it says that Jesus condemned sin in the flesh.  This would obviously include His own flesh.  So this means that somehow Jesus had to condemn sin in His own flesh.  Therefore, desires that could result in sin must arise in His heart that He was able to subdue via the Spirit before it could become sin.

Paul

Offline Seth

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #361 on: July 17, 2009, 07:19:11 PM »
Paul you are not acknowledging what I said. Even if Jesus came in sinful flesh, it doesn't matter. His mind was Spiritual. He was not IN the flesh. The Bible is clear that we LOSE the ability to sin the more we enter into the Spirit, by having the flesh crucified with all it's affections and lusts. Do you know that you can be clothed in flesh, yet NOT IN the flesh? Christ could have sinful flesh, and be without sin by NOT BEING IN the flesh but in the SPIRIT.

Jesus condemned (judged) sin in the flesh. How so? By having the Holy Spirit!
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 07:35:26 PM by Seth »

Offline Molly

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #362 on: July 17, 2009, 08:25:26 PM »
40How oft did they provoke him in the wilderness, and grieve him in the desert!

 41Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.

 42They remembered not his hand, nor the day when he delivered them from the enemy.


--Psalm 78



They would tempt God himself if given the chance.  Jesus is the Holy One of Israel.  Even the demons know who he is [" the Holy One of God" Lk 4:34]  It is Jesus versus the flesh, and Jesus wins.   Because he is our king, we, too, can win this battle.




Psalm 89:18
For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.

Offline Cardinal

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #363 on: July 17, 2009, 08:35:09 PM »
Jesus took on sinful flesh:

Rom 8:3  For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

If Jesus flesh was not of the ability to sin then He wasn't given sinful flesh.  Additionally, it says that Jesus condemned sin in the flesh.  This would obviously include His own flesh.  So this means that somehow Jesus had to condemn sin in His own flesh.  Therefore, desires that could result in sin must arise in His heart that He was able to subdue via the Spirit before it could become sin.

Paul

 :cloud9: AMEN Paul. What makes it so hard to see is not understanding that the Son/Seed He sent was SPIRIT, as each Seed bears fruit after it's OWN KIND, and the Father is a Spirit who bears Spirit Seed.

This Seed came in the likeness of sinful flesh (flesh man Jesus), or another way to say it, is that it too was lowered into this bondage of corruption, which is what sinful flesh IS.

It is this SPIRIT SEED that was given Him in the womb, the wheat that is raised up TOGETHER with the tares in the field of Matt. 13 that is the natural man, that OVERCOMES the tares/sinful flesh. This is the anointing from within.

This is why He overcame sin IN THE FLESH, beginning with His own. This Seed is He who both DESCENDED (into flesh beginning with the man Jesus) and ASCENDED (back to origination point) back to the glory that He had before.

We too, were as spirits lowered into flesh/bondage of corruption, but He subjected the same in hope, ie. Christ/Spirit Seed in you, hope of glory/ascending back to origination point.

When He received the anointing from without (dove), then His ministry began. In like fashion, when we receive the baptism in the HG which does the WORKS, our ministry to the body should begin.

If you add the anointing from within with the anointing from without, you have inner layer of gold inside the Ark of the Covenant, followed by the outer layer of gold, both of which cover the "sheetim" (had to change spelling because of board restrictions) wood, which is as our/his humanity.

This is the pattern and cannot be broken, He WAS/IS the PATTERN SON. Following this pattern brings us to Romans 8 talking about the SONS of God who are going to be manifested, yet He is called the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD.

Only begotten means THERE'S ONLY ONE, but He became a many membered body which is SPIRIT, ie. a HARVEST from the ONE SEED.

And He did say when you've seen ME you've seen the Father, but the '"me" there was the Spirit/Seed that came from the Father, and therefore was the express image of the Father.

This is the revelation upon which He builds His church, ie. Peter flesh and blood (not even His) have revealed this to you, but your Father which is in heaven. What was revealed?

Thou art the Christ/Spirit Seed/Anointed one. In other words, WHO is it you hear talking to you, Peter? This is why we are told that hereafter we'll not know Him after the flesh but after the Spirit.

The flesh of Him is "gone" in that it was consumed from the glory which was within, ie. MORTALITY covered up of IMMORTALITY, which is the PATTERN.

He was given pre-eminence as the FIRSTBORN of many brethren. He was not firstborn of the FLESH! He was firstborn of the SPIRIT!

Name denotes nature and there is no other NATURE under heaven like this name/nature, BY WHICH WE ARE SAVED, from this bondage of corruption we have been lowered into.

In My Father's house are many mansions. In the older Strong's 'mansions' there runs into a meaning of "nests". The booths of the feast of Tabernacles are as NESTS. They are 'nests' for the overcoming 'eagles'. He goes to prepare a place for us, that where He is, we might be also.

Where is He and how did He get there? The pattern is above. Blessings....

« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 08:48:00 PM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Seth

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #364 on: July 17, 2009, 08:51:04 PM »
40How oft did they provoke him in the wilderness, and grieve him in the desert!

 41Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.

 42They remembered not his hand, nor the day when he delivered them from the enemy.


--Psalm 78



They would tempt God himself if given the chance.  Jesus is the Holy One of Israel.  Even the demons know who he is [" the Holy One of God" Lk 4:34]  It is Jesus versus the flesh, and Jesus wins.   Because he is our king, we, too, can win this battle.




Psalm 89:18
For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.


The Lord is our defense. Isn't that amazing? He is a DEFENDER.

What does Romans 8 show that the Lord defends us from? Our own FLESH.

How can Jesus come in the likeness of sinful flesh, yet be without sin? Paul, remember, it does not say, that he was tempted in all ways, yet did not bring sin forth. It says he was without sin itself.

What must be in place for someone to have sinful flesh, yet be WITHOUT sin itself?

The flesh must be CRUCIFIED!

And the question is, can our flesh be crucified while we are clothed in it? OF COURSE! Jesus Christ said: IF YOU HAVE SEEN ME, YOU HAVE SEEN THE FATHER. The Holy Spirit is our DEFENDER!

The Spirit defends our minds from our flesh, and the lusts created by it. Jesus did not have evil desire. His....flesh....was....crucified.

His literal crucifixion was a picture of the righteousness his father already gave him. THAT is why Jesus DID NOT DIE FOR HIMSELF BUT FOR THE UNGODLY.


Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #365 on: July 17, 2009, 08:52:05 PM »
So Card,
                                                                               Maybe we're in the nests NOW.
Instead of waiting for tabernacles, it might be more like getting ready to LEAVE THE NEST!
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 09:00:57 PM by Beloved Servant »

Offline Cardinal

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #366 on: July 17, 2009, 08:53:35 PM »
 :cloud9: Yes, Beloved Servant........the feast of Tabernacles HAS COME. Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Molly

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #367 on: July 17, 2009, 08:57:35 PM »
42Ye shall dwell in booths seven days; all that are Israelites born shall dwell in booths:
--Lev 23

"booths"

H5521
סכּה
sûkkâh
sook-kaw'
Feminine of H5520; a hut or lair: - booth, cottage, covert, pavilion, tabernacle, tent.


43That your generations may know that I made the children of Israel to dwell in booths, when I brought them out of the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

--Lev 23


The Israelites were given a place to stay seven days out of the year, during the Feast of Tabernacles.  But, Jesus gives us a place to stay permenantly.




John 14:2
In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

"mansions"

G3438
μονή
monē
mon-ay'
From G3306; a staying, that is, residence (the act or the place): - abode, mansion.


G3306
μένω
menō
men'-o
A primary verb; to stay (in a given place, state, relation or expectancy): - abide, continue, dwell, endure, be present, remain, stand, tarry (for), X thine own.


My goodness, Cardinal, he is giving us new bodies. :mshock:


3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

--Rev 21

[the] "tabernacle" [of God]

G4633
σκηνή
skēnē
skay-nay'
Apparently akin to G4632 and G4639; a tent or cloth hut (literally or figuratively): - habitation, tabernacle.

« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 09:03:31 PM by Molly »

Offline Cardinal

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #368 on: July 17, 2009, 09:09:47 PM »
Molly said, "My goodness, Cardinal, he is giving us new bodies. Mshock"



:cloud9: Yes He is Molly........if you take the 7 days allotted for feast of Tabernacles
MULTIPLIED times He who IS the 7th day it = JUBILEE. Be fruitful and MULTIPLY.

Wanted to also add, that in Jubilee every man's land/possession was returned to him. What did we lose? Our glory that we had before the foundation of the world = glorified body "land".

Truly we have been sojourners in a STRANGE LAND, NOT our possession. The glorified body is not something we have never had, but rather what we had BEFORE when we were one with Him from the foundation. He is returning our land/new earth to us. Blessings....

Where are you RLV?
« Last Edit: July 17, 2009, 09:24:17 PM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Molly

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #369 on: July 17, 2009, 09:12:11 PM »
 17For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

 18But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy.

 19And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.

 20There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.

 21And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.

 22They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.

 23They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD, and their offspring with them.

 24And it shall come to pass, that before they call, I will answer; and while they are yet speaking, I will hear.

 25The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.

--Isa 65

trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #370 on: July 17, 2009, 09:20:10 PM »
Paul you are not acknowledging what I said. Even if Jesus came in sinful flesh, it doesn't matter. His mind was Spiritual. He was not IN the flesh. The Bible is clear that we LOSE the ability to sin the more we enter into the Spirit, by having the flesh crucified with all it's affections and lusts. Do you know that you can be clothed in flesh, yet NOT IN the flesh? Christ could have sinful flesh, and be without sin by NOT BEING IN the flesh but in the SPIRIT.

Jesus condemned (judged) sin in the flesh. How so? By having the Holy Spirit!

His mind was Spiritual (of the Holy Spirit).  And yes He wasn't in the flesh (pertaining to abiding by the flesh).  See I have a DIFFERENT understanding of what Spirit means than you obviously.  To me Spirit is a behavior.  And the Holy Spirit is a very SPECIFIC Behavior.    Sure Jesus can have sinful flesh and be without sin but this doesn't mean that His mind never has thoughts that could lead to sin (should He not have The Spirit to overcome them).

I believe that last point is where we differ. 

Paul

Offline Molly

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #371 on: July 17, 2009, 09:25:14 PM »
Molly said, "My goodness, Cardinal, he is giving us new bodies. Mshock"



:cloud9: Yes He is Molly........if you take the 7 days allotted for feast of Tabernacles
MULTIPLIED times He who IS the 7th day it = JUBILEE. Be fruitful and MULTIPLY.

Wanted to also add, that in Jubilee every man's land/possession was returned to him. What did we lose? Our glory that we had before the foundation of the world = glorified body "land".

Truly we have been sojourners in a STRANGE LAND, NOT our possession. Blessings....

Where are you RLV?

He is making our bodies, our flesh, into a tabernacle for himself.  :mshock:


34Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces.

 35Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.


--Daniel 2



trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #372 on: July 17, 2009, 09:27:59 PM »
Jesus took on sinful flesh:

Rom 8:3  For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

If Jesus flesh was not of the ability to sin then He wasn't given sinful flesh.  Additionally, it says that Jesus condemned sin in the flesh.  This would obviously include His own flesh.  So this means that somehow Jesus had to condemn sin in His own flesh.  Therefore, desires that could result in sin must arise in His heart that He was able to subdue via the Spirit before it could become sin.

Paul

 :cloud9: AMEN Paul. What makes it so hard to see is not understanding that the Son/Seed He sent was SPIRIT, as each Seed bears fruit after it's OWN KIND, and the Father is a Spirit who bears Spirit Seed.

This Seed came in the likeness of sinful flesh (flesh man Jesus), or another way to say it, is that it too was lowered into this bondage of corruption, which is what sinful flesh IS.

It is this SPIRIT SEED that was given Him in the womb, the wheat that is raised up TOGETHER with the tares in the field of Matt. 13 that is the natural man, that OVERCOMES the tares/sinful flesh. This is the anointing from within.

This is why He overcame sin IN THE FLESH, beginning with His own. This Seed is He who both DESCENDED (into flesh beginning with the man Jesus) and ASCENDED (back to origination point) back to the glory that He had before.

We too, were as spirits lowered into flesh/bondage of corruption, but He subjected the same in hope, ie. Christ/Spirit Seed in you, hope of glory/ascending back to origination point.

When He received the anointing from without (dove), then His ministry began. In like fashion, when we receive the baptism in the HG which does the WORKS, our ministry to the body should begin.

If you add the anointing from within with the anointing from without, you have inner layer of gold inside the Ark of the Covenant, followed by the outer layer of gold, both of which cover the "sheetim" (had to change spelling because of board restrictions) wood, which is as our/his humanity.

This is the pattern and cannot be broken, He WAS/IS the PATTERN SON. Following this pattern brings us to Romans 8 talking about the SONS of God who are going to be manifested, yet He is called the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD.

Only begotten means THERE'S ONLY ONE, but He became a many membered body which is SPIRIT, ie. a HARVEST from the ONE SEED.

And He did say when you've seen ME you've seen the Father, but the '"me" there was the Spirit/Seed that came from the Father, and therefore was the express image of the Father.

This is the revelation upon which He builds His church, ie. Peter flesh and blood (not even His) have revealed this to you, but your Father which is in heaven. What was revealed?

Thou art the Christ/Spirit Seed/Anointed one. In other words, WHO is it you hear talking to you, Peter? This is why we are told that hereafter we'll not know Him after the flesh but after the Spirit.

The flesh of Him is "gone" in that it was consumed from the glory which was within, ie. MORTALITY covered up of IMMORTALITY, which is the PATTERN.

He was given pre-eminence as the FIRSTBORN of many brethren. He was not firstborn of the FLESH! He was firstborn of the SPIRIT!

Name denotes nature and there is no other NATURE under heaven like this name/nature, BY WHICH WE ARE SAVED, from this bondage of corruption we have been lowered into.

In My Father's house are many mansions. In the older Strong's 'mansions' there runs into a meaning of "nests". The booths of the feast of Tabernacles are as NESTS. They are 'nests' for the overcoming 'eagles'. He goes to prepare a place for us, that where He is, we might be also.

Where is He and how did He get there? The pattern is above. Blessings....



Great post Cardinal.

Paul

trettep

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #373 on: July 17, 2009, 09:31:23 PM »
40How oft did they provoke him in the wilderness, and grieve him in the desert!

 41Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.

 42They remembered not his hand, nor the day when he delivered them from the enemy.


--Psalm 78



They would tempt God himself if given the chance.  Jesus is the Holy One of Israel.  Even the demons know who he is [" the Holy One of God" Lk 4:34]  It is Jesus versus the flesh, and Jesus wins.   Because he is our king, we, too, can win this battle.




Psalm 89:18
For the LORD is our defence; and the Holy One of Israel is our king.


The Lord is our defense. Isn't that amazing? He is a DEFENDER.

What does Romans 8 show that the Lord defends us from? Our own FLESH.

How can Jesus come in the likeness of sinful flesh, yet be without sin? Paul, remember, it does not say, that he was tempted in all ways, yet did not bring sin forth. It says he was without sin itself.

What must be in place for someone to have sinful flesh, yet be WITHOUT sin itself?

The flesh must be CRUCIFIED!

And the question is, can our flesh be crucified while we are clothed in it? OF COURSE! Jesus Christ said: IF YOU HAVE SEEN ME, YOU HAVE SEEN THE FATHER. The Holy Spirit is our DEFENDER!

The Spirit defends our minds from our flesh, and the lusts created by it. Jesus did not have evil desire. His....flesh....was....crucified.

His literal crucifixion was a picture of the righteousness his father already gave him. THAT is why Jesus DID NOT DIE FOR HIMSELF BUT FOR THE UNGODLY.



But He was tempted in all ways as we are and did NOT BRING FORTH SIN.  That is what the scriptures are INDEED showing us.

Paul

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Re: YOU are Satan...
« Reply #374 on: July 17, 2009, 09:38:21 PM »
 :cloud9: AMEN Paul.........Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor