Author Topic: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions  (Read 15109 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #175 on: November 02, 2012, 06:01:13 PM »
thinking on what Jesus said about the strong man Matt 12;29   or again,how can anyone

  enter a strong man's house and carry off his possessions unless her first ties him up[binds him]

  then he can rob his house.

   tares removed and bound up in bundles by the angels,so wheat may be gathered in the barn...

   you know a weed is very vigorous.  it never ceases to amze me with it's tenacity.

  look what happens when satan is bound!! reign of Christ!..look what happens when he is loosed...

  he completely surrounds the camp of the Holy city

  Habakak 1;4  the wicked surround[bind in sin/flesh] the righteous[spirits of just men made perfect] so that justice is

 perverted..............

 

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #176 on: November 02, 2012, 06:12:44 PM »
 what is left but the fire come down from heaven to consume the tares that bind us?

   Acts 2;3  they saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that seperated and came to rest on each of them.

   this the token of the Holy spirit..the down payment of what is to come[fullness]

Offline dajomaco

  • 500
  • *
  • Posts: 863
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #177 on: November 02, 2012, 06:50:00 PM »
Has God ever been forgiven?
To really Love some times in a relationship, we need to forgive one an other.
To receive forgiveness, is a beautiful aspect of Love.
To forgive is even more divine.
   
We are told to forgive one another one as we are forgiven.
 This is Love.
God has never experienced what is like to be forgiven.
He experiences forgiveness through us.

That experience is through a glass darkly.
Soon and very soon we will see him in all of his Glory.
He will also see us in all our Glory he will see first hand not second hand.
The Glorious nature of his Forgiveness through his Sons sacrifice on the Cross.
We will be  presented .
When we are presented every thought  we have of Gods forgiveness,
 will be eternally posted for all of the sons of God to see.
This will be our credentials presented to the Sons of God as they are brought in to
the throne room of judgment for us to pass judgment on them.

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #178 on: November 02, 2012, 07:35:59 PM »
The old man is dead.  He is dead man walking.  He is a slave to death.  He can only choose death.  He is already judged and condemned. 


And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.  John 3:19


in their deceit they refuse to acknowledge me," declares the LORD.  Jer 9:6

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #179 on: November 02, 2012, 08:19:42 PM »
I 'hear" this Molly...after reading your post.  When God told the king that took Sarah into his house....

  YOU ARE AS GOOD AS A DEAD MAN FOR YOU HAVE ANOTHER MAN'S WIFE

  God made man for His spirit to dwell in..not another spirit man

Offline ded2daworld

  • Silver
  • *
  • Posts: 2100
  • Gender: Male
  • What if today we were just grateful for everything
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #180 on: November 02, 2012, 08:34:34 PM »
  YOU ARE AS GOOD AS A DEAD MAN FOR YOU HAVE ANOTHER MAN'S WIFE
...and yet the king was totally innocent of any wrong doing due to Abrahams half truth. Interesting.
"Why do so many people think that the Bible is only inspired at certain points -  and that  THEY are inspired to pick out which points?"

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #181 on: November 02, 2012, 08:56:16 PM »
nevrtheless,he paid 1000 silver pieces[all the fruit of the vinyard]

   SOS...the 1000 peices of silver are  for you..and 200 for the keepers of the vineyard

   my sister my spouse

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 3988
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #182 on: November 03, 2012, 06:49:02 AM »
what is left but the fire come down from heaven to consume the tares that bind us?

   Acts 2;3  they saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that seperated and came to rest on each of them.

   this the token of the Holy spirit..the down payment of what is to come[fullness]

Einsteins associate Max Planck discovered that when light shines on metal it releases particles, I think they were atoms,or photons, can't remember. It was a measurable phenomena, but Planck(and everyone else) was puzzled as to why the phenmena stopped occuring at a certain point as the light was decreased.

In other words, as the light decreased the photons should have just continued to be released in lesser quantity, but they didnt, they stopped at a certain point. Einstein hypothesized and proved that light is also made up of particles(this was rejected when he proposed it by Planck and others, until he PROVED IT TRUE). He then postulated that there was a particular point at which the energy needed to be sufficient in strength to be GREATER THAN the force holding the atoms together.

We are like that ourselves. There needs to be a CERTAIN LEVEL OF LIGHT before the PARTICLES OF WHICH WE ARE MADE, will RELEASE FROM THE CARNAL LUMP. That level is perfectly described by Paul in Romans chapter 12,

 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office: So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
(Rom 12:1-5)

This point of light necessary to the RELEASE OF THE SPIRIT is also described in Ephesians Chapter 4 and I Corinthians 12- 14, as well as by Peter in 1 Peter 4:10,11.

As each one has received a special gift, employ it in serving one another as good stewards of the manifold grace of God. Whoever speaks, is to do so as one who is speaking the utterances of God; whoever serves is to do so as one who is serving by the strength which God supplies; so that in all things God may be glorified through Jesus Christ, to whom belongs the glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.
(1Pe 4:10-11)

It is described by Luke in Acts 2 and in Acts 4

It is described by Jesus in John 17 and in John 13

They were all in one place in one accord ministering unto the Lord
If I wash not your feet you have no part in me....as I have done to you do so to one another
They were all as one soul.....Great grace was upon them all and the WORD OF THE LORD grew and multiplied
Yield your bodies as a living sacrifice.....let no man esteem himself more highly than he ought, for TO EACH ONE IS GIVEN THE MEASURE OF FAITH
What is it when you come together, one has a pslam, one has a teaching, one has a revelation
All may prophesy that all may learn and be edified
Let the prophets speak and let the others judge
I pray that you may be one even as I and My Father are one that your joy may be full

but speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in all aspects into Him who is the head, even Christ, from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by what every joint supplies, according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the building up of itself in love.
(Eph 4:15-16)

We are the metal, made so by His grace, but like negative ions on the ground rise up to meet positive ions in the heavens- until they TOUCH AND LIGHTNING FLASHES AND THUNDER ROLLS- there is no MANIFESTATION unless HEAVEN AND EARTH MEET.

The life giving spirit, the quickening spirit, the tongues of fire descending to rest upon the heads of "acceptable sacrifices"

They are the broken and contrite hearts, and they can be recognized by their love for one another.

Since you have in obedience to the truth purified your souls unto a sincere love of the brethren, fervently love one another from the heart, for you have been born from above not of seed which is perishable but imperishable, that is, through the living and enduring word of God.
(1Pe 1:22-23)

Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have obtained our introduction by faith into this grace in which we stand; and we exult in hope of the glory of God. And not only this, but we also exult in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance; and perseverance, proven character; and proven character, hope; and hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out within our hearts through the Holy Spirit who was given to us.
(Rom 5:1-5)

That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.
(1Co 12:25-31)

Arise O Lord to Thy dwelling place, Thou and the ark of Thy strength.

Glory to God!








« Last Edit: November 03, 2012, 06:56:49 AM by eaglesway »
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline ded2daworld

  • Silver
  • *
  • Posts: 2100
  • Gender: Male
  • What if today we were just grateful for everything
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #183 on: November 03, 2012, 03:12:05 PM »
Wow! That was great and deep Eaglesway. Thank you...it was photons.
"Why do so many people think that the Bible is only inspired at certain points -  and that  THEY are inspired to pick out which points?"

Offline Paul L

  • Est
  • *
  • Posts: 259
  • Gender: Male
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #184 on: November 03, 2012, 06:32:50 PM »

Quote
Einsteins associate Max Planck discovered that when light shines on metal it releases particles, I think they were atoms,or photons, can't remember.

Electrons are released from the outermost orbital shell of the atom when specific wavelengths of light are shined upon specific metals. The yellow wavelength seems to be the most efficient. Of course the greater the intensity of the light beam shining upon the surface of the metal, the greater will be the flow of electrons.

Quote
Einstein hypothesized and proved that light is also made up of particles(this was rejected when he proposed it by Planck and others, until he PROVED IT TRUE).

Correct, the particles of light are called photons.

 He then postulated that there was a particular point at which the energy needed to be sufficient in strength to be GREATER THAN the force holding the atoms together.

Quote
We are like that ourselves. There needs to be a CERTAIN LEVEL OF LIGHT before the PARTICLES OF WHICH WE ARE MADE, will RELEASE FROM THE CARNAL LUMP. That level is perfectly described by Paul in Romans chapter 12,

Insightful to say the least......the more intense the light & more pure the wavelength, the greater efficiency by which electrons are released.

 
Quote
We are the metal, made so by His grace, but like negative ions on the ground rise up to meet positive ions in the heavens- until they TOUCH AND LIGHTNING FLASHES AND THUNDER ROLLS- there is no MANIFESTATION unless HEAVEN AND EARTH MEET.

Positive ions are atoms whose outermost shell of electrons have been stripped of  one or more electrons, this results in an atom whose charge is out of balance and which seeks to bring its' charge back to neutral by acquiring an electron.

A negative ion is an atom which has an excess of electrons in its outermost orbital shell resulting in a negatively charged atom . These atoms will readily give up those excess electrons to the closest positively charged atom it detects, resulting in the movement of electrons, or what is called electricity.

You're on a roll my brother, keep rolling & you will gather no moss......


Offline dajomaco

  • 500
  • *
  • Posts: 863
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #185 on: November 03, 2012, 07:16:56 PM »
I have a pan of water and a chair by the front door .
Hoping to see you soon

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #186 on: November 03, 2012, 07:30:08 PM »
 the rainbow covenant in the Heavens..God's token of never again......water droplets/dew ofHeaven

   white encompasses all colours of rainbow[coat of many colours] black=without light/judgement

Offline ded2daworld

  • Silver
  • *
  • Posts: 2100
  • Gender: Male
  • What if today we were just grateful for everything
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #187 on: November 03, 2012, 08:52:47 PM »
 1 John - "God is light and in Him is NO darkness at all. None."
"Why do so many people think that the Bible is only inspired at certain points -  and that  THEY are inspired to pick out which points?"

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #188 on: November 03, 2012, 09:48:36 PM »
"Light is a wave."

"Light is a particle."

"It's both.  Light is a wavicle."




Job 37:19 "Tell us what we should say to him; we cannot draw up our case because of our darkness.



But if we hope for what we do not see, we wait for it with patience.

Likewise the Spirit also helps our weakness: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought but the Spirit himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.  Rom 8:25-26


Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #189 on: November 03, 2012, 10:49:16 PM »
Black has a place..two onx stones engraved with 12 tribes of Isreals names were bore on the shoulders

  of the hIGH pREIST.  tHE BLACK STONE ALSO SIGNIFYS A 'NAY' REPLY OF gOD..JUST AS A WHITE

  IS YES[URIM AND THUMMIN]  THE BLACK HORSE WITH THE SCALES..SAYING..BARLEY..WHEAT

  HURT NOT THE OIL OR WINE IS PART OF THE MESSAGE  OF THE FOUR HORSEMEN

   PAY ATTENTION TO HIS JUDGEMENTS..WHEAT AND BARLEY[SPIRITUAL FOOD TO SUSTAIN

  A MAN AND HIS FAMILY]  WHILE A FAMINE FOR THE WORD OF GOD IS IN THE LAND  hURT NOT

  THE OIL AND WINE..HOLY SPIRIT OIL AND WINE OF CHRISTdevINE...[I HAVE DESIRED TO DRINK

  THIS CUP WITH YOU. THE BLACK HORSE,BLACK STONE..NAY GOES TOWARDS SATAN AND HIS

  EVIL KINGDOM OF DEMONS/THEY ARE NOT PROTECTED OF THE LIGHT OF HIS FACE/AND

 RECEIVE NO WORD OF LIFE THAT THEY SHALL LIVE[MAN LIVES BY EVERY WORD FROM THE

MOUTH OFGOD BUT NOT SATAN AND EVIL SPIRIT CONTRASTS TOOLS.

   FATHER SAYS 'IT IS I MYSELF THAT HAVE CREATED THE 'BLACK SMITH/TOOL OF DARKNESS]

  BUT LOOK HE [ZECHARIAH 1;18-20] DOES THE AXE WEILD HIMSELF ABOVE HIM THAT SWINGS IT

  OR THE SAW BOAST AGAINST HIM WHO USES IT,OR AS IF A ROD WERE TO WIELD HIM THAT USES IT

OR A CLUB BRANDISH HIM WHO IS NOT WOOD

  ZECHARIAH 1;8 DURING THE NIGHT I HAD A VISION-AND THERE BEFORE ME WAS A MAN RIDING

  A RED HORSE.HE WAS STANDING AMONG THE MYRTLE TREES IN A RAVINE,BHIND HIM

 WERE RED BROWN AND WHITE HORSES....WHO ARE THESE? THEY ARE THE ONES THE LORD HAS SENT TO

 GO THROUGH OUT THE EARTH..AND THEY REPORTED TOTHE LORD OF THE EARTH.

  PROCLAIM,THIS IS WHAT THE LORD ALMIGHTY SAYS...'I AM VERY JEALOUS FOR JERUSALEM

 AND ZION.

  FOUR HORNS AND FOUR CRAFTSMAN...THE FOUR HORNS SCATTERED JUDAH ISREAL AND

 JERUSALEM[4 CORNERS OF EARTH]  THEN THE LORD SHOWED ME FOUR CRAFTSMEN

 WHAT ARE THESE COMING TODO?  THE CRAFTSMEN HAVE COME TO TERRIFY THEM AND

THROW DOWN THESE HORNS OF THE NATIONS AGAINST THE LAND OF JUDAH

   [FOUR HORNS/BABYLON/MEDO-PERSIA/GREECE/ROME] KING OF BABYLON IMAGE

 ZECHARIAH 6 FOUR CHARIOTS..COMING OUTFROM BETWEEN TWO MOUNTAINS OF BRONZE

 RED HORSES,BLACK,WHITE AND DAPPLED..WHAT ARE THESE?.......

  THESE ARE THE FOUR SPIRITS OF HEAVEN GOING OUT FROM STANDING BEFORE THE LORD....

  LOOK THOSE GOING TOWARD THE NORTH COUNTRY GIVE  MY SPIRIT REST IN THE LAND OF THE

 NORTH COUNTRY[BABYLON]

  BLACK HAS A VERY IMPORTANT PLACE

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3575
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #190 on: November 03, 2012, 10:55:25 PM »
P.S.  THE BLACK HORSES WENT TO THE NORTH/BABYLONIA..AND GIVE THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD

  REST.

Offline Paul L

  • Est
  • *
  • Posts: 259
  • Gender: Male
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #191 on: November 03, 2012, 11:02:21 PM »
"Light is a wave."

"Light is a particle."

"It's both.  Light is a wavicle."

Good job Mol, I'll bet you're good with poetry as well. I'll pass this on to a few friends in my circle in the science community & get their reaction......wavicle, OK, Albert Einstein, Max Planck, & Neils Bohr, move over ,Molly's on a roll too.

Offline jabcat

  • Admin
  • *
  • Posts: 8952
  • SINNER SAVED BY GRACE
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #192 on: November 03, 2012, 11:21:27 PM »
shows you what mental level i'm on.  reminds me of popsicle. 
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #193 on: November 03, 2012, 11:55:46 PM »
"Light is a wave."

"Light is a particle."

"It's both.  Light is a wavicle."

Good job Mol, I'll bet you're good with poetry as well. I'll pass this on to a few friends in my circle in the science community & get their reaction......wavicle, OK, Albert Einstein, Max Planck, & Neils Bohr, move over ,Molly's on a roll too.
That's sweet, Paul, but it's not mine.  It's what I was taught.  :girlheart:

I like popsicles, too.



Wavicle


n. A wave-particle; specifically, quantum entities viewed as neither waves nor particles but a mixture of both
« Last Edit: November 04, 2012, 12:04:19 AM by Molly »

Offline ded2daworld

  • Silver
  • *
  • Posts: 2100
  • Gender: Male
  • What if today we were just grateful for everything
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #194 on: November 04, 2012, 12:50:46 AM »
probably off discussion, but this interesting.
Light is affected by our observation. If you look at light and try to see the particle it looks like a wave. If you try to look at it as a wave, it looks like a particle. Weird huh? Maybe that's why God is different when we look at Him in a certain way expecting an outcome.
Wavicle - NOT the silly "God particle" scientist are swooning over lately.
"Why do so many people think that the Bible is only inspired at certain points -  and that  THEY are inspired to pick out which points?"

Offline Paul L

  • Est
  • *
  • Posts: 259
  • Gender: Male
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #195 on: November 04, 2012, 01:52:44 AM »
probably off discussion, but this interesting.
Light is affected by our observation. If you look at light and try to see the particle it looks like a wave. If you try to look at it as a wave, it looks like a particle. Weird huh? Maybe that's why God is different when we look at Him in a certain way expecting an outcome.
Wavicle - NOT the silly "God particle" scientist are swooning over lately.

It is the so-called "God particle", it is indivisible although theorists in Quantum Mechanics are attempting to divide it with "entanglement" experiments using lasers.

Mass is simply bound up energy, or to say it another way, mass is energy trapped in a room with no doors, no way out. But if something should poke a hole in a wall in that doorless room, a tiny bit of that trapped energy will transform into photons & rush to that hole,  some will make it through before the hole repairs itself, and this is what we see as light photons, wavicles

If all the atoms in your body could be transformed into pure energy (photons), your body could light up the world for a few days. In nuclear physics we already know how to do this, but building the equipment for doing it is prohibitively expensive, to build a cost effective alchemy facility to create such energy will never be within man's reach.

 
« Last Edit: November 04, 2012, 02:35:16 AM by Paul L »

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 3988
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #196 on: November 04, 2012, 06:34:41 AM »
probably off discussion, but this interesting.
Light is affected by our observation. If you look at light and try to see the particle it looks like a wave. If you try to look at it as a wave, it looks like a particle. Weird huh? Maybe that's why God is different when we look at Him in a certain way expecting an outcome.
Wavicle - NOT the silly "God particle" scientist are swooning over lately.

IMO not off topic at all,actually right on point. Man's will is the particle,    God's will is the wave.  Look for the wave, see the particle- look for the particle, see the wave.

"For who has known the mind of the Lord, and who has been  his counselor......       " :o)
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline dajomaco

  • 500
  • *
  • Posts: 863
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #197 on: November 04, 2012, 07:11:33 PM »
Observe watch scrutinize.
Opened eyes.
realize.
Behold the glass darkly.
Look particularly
molecularly.
God has made emphatically 
All of physicality
Radically .
I was blind but know I see.
 

Offline lomarah

  • Silver
  • *
  • Posts: 2227
  • Gender: Female
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #198 on: November 04, 2012, 07:33:57 PM »
Rad!  :dsunny:
From Him and through Him and to Him are all things.

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 3988
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions
« Reply #199 on: November 04, 2012, 08:56:36 PM »
n. A wave-particle; specifically, quantum entities viewed as neither waves nor particles but a mixture of both

This is where I was kinda hoping this discussion would go in spirit.

Theoretically, there may be a wavicle :o) The mechanics of such a thing are beyond our ability to visualize at present, either physically or mathematically, yet something about the behavior of the smallest particles we have been able to conceive of or identify lead us continually into things deeper than we can see- when will it end? HAH- hopefully never, because EVERY TIME WE ARRIVE we get a surprise that DOESNT FIT THE EXPECTATION. Light was a particle until it became a wave, and that didnt work so now we have a wavicle.

He divided the waters from the waters. All things were created by Him and all things, "hold together by the Word of His power"(Heb1). The advent of wav theory and theories of wave/particle duality is an exciting step towards understanding the "waters" through physics, and tho I don't believe science will ever get there completely- I get a kick out of the progressive consternation as one generation of arrogance succumbs to the inquisitiveness of the next generation. Inquisitiveness leads to honest inquiry, and co-operation between the diggers.

Arrogance leads to trench digging and fortress building around concepts that only partially explain the truth but are worshipped like graven images.

As we try to go smaller and smaller in understanding the MEETING POINT between predestination and choice, election and stewardship, sovereignity of God and whatever degree of sovereignity God has given man- There is an EVENT HORIZON that is incalculable by us in this plane of existence. It can not be fully known until we know as we know as we are known and the last veil is torn. Therefore, it ought never be the SOURCE OF DIVISION since the CLEARER AND DEEPER REVELATION IS THE LOVE OF GOD AND THE ONESS OF THE SAINTS IN THAT LOVE- WAVE PARTICLE DUALITY MAN!!!!!! HAHA

We Christians hammer upon each other about terms like the "sovereignity of God" and "free will" or "man's will"- but most don't do the work. They don't buy the field. They don't dig for the treasure. The treasure is the "duality". The truth hidden behind seemingly opposing paradigms :o).

Paradoxicle wavicles of the word HAHAHA.

 Beyond the hard headed insistence of the "prevailing system of interpretation" there is a supposedly integral underlying revelation, available through the Logos that, being revealed in the Spirit, brings unity of the faith as the Body of Christ grows up in all things into the Head, speaking the truth in love as we become the "mature man", "rooted and grounded in love" so that we can be "filled up to all the fulness of God".

Acts 17:24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands.  And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything. Rather, he himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else.  From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands.  God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us.  'For in him we live and move and have our being.'As some of your own poets have said, 'We are his offspring.'

Romans 11:33-36 33
 Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God!
    How unsearchable his judgments,
    and his paths beyond tracing out!
 "Who has known the mind of the Lord?
    Or who has been his counselor?"
 "Who has ever given to God,
    that God should repay them?"
 For from him and through him and for him are all things.
    To him be the glory forever! Amen.

Disclaimer: The above statements are merely MY OWN OPINION and are by no means being presented as systematic theology that anyone else ought to accept for any other reason than that they come to similar conclusions out of their own study of the word; observations of nature; reason; and fellowship with the Spirit. :declare:

The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com