Discussions Relating to Universal Reconciliation > Christian Life

God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions

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     There is going to be an experiment. Tentmaker Forums is going to allow a discussion of subject matter regarding the sovereign will of God and man's will in relationship to God. This is a subject of great interest, substantial complexity and sometimes unfortunately,  heated passions.

     The terminology surrounding this discussion is made difficult as our understandings of certain words and the way they fit into our diverse theology often differ.

     The idea that such a subject should be discouraged is unfortunate, but because the controversy and the kind of strife it can generate is so serious and often grievous- it has for a time been strongly discouraged and quickly redirected.

The moderation of the experiment will be focused at maintaining an attitude of polite discussion between brothers and sisters sharing their perspectives respectfully. Scripture ought to salt these discussion as participants "speak the truth in love", as they see it.

     I personally believe God is absolutely sovereign. He can and does whatever He wants to whenever He wants to- He is like the wind and He is like the rock. He has set in motion a purpose, "His kind intention"(rock)(Eph 1:10,11). He has left within a certain amount of "inscrutable mystery"(wind) so that we may never say that we have been His counselor(Romans 11:33-36).

     I also believe that within God's plan as he teaches us to be like Him- like the wind and the rock- He leaves us also a certain stewardship- a limited sovereignity freely exercised as we learn to be conformed to His image. Eventually, in my view, the will of man(all) merges with the will of God in a mutually given love that is like a cataract falling over a mountainside or a wind blowing through the leaves of a willow tree. IMO This happens sooner for some, later for others. The balance between the foreknowledge of God, the predestination of individuals, calling and election versus concepts like repentance, obedience, sanctification are like two sides of one coin to me.

      I do not believe my view is "correct". It is only the small window of one persons experience in seeking the Lord and studying His word. Actually, I do not believe a "correct view" exists on this side of the veil- and that is why we strive so intensely against one another. We are not comfortable with fuzzy edges- we like clarity. We love to "know".

      I suggest we speak as those who see through a glass darkly, even if we think we absolutely possess the whole counsel of God.
Hopefully, some will ask questions and others will bring forth their views without unleashing a firestorm :o). I have friends who do not see things as I do. Let's be like friend's discussing subjects of interest. Let's not judge anyones spirituality by whether they agree with us or make our view the standard of measure. As long as we can discuss these things in an atmosphere of fellowship, and praise God for His grace, we can continue to do so and edify one another. Participants who cannot abide by this rule will get a warning. After the first warning they may be disallowed from participating for a time if they don't get it. Hopefully the experiment will be a great success.


Great starter John.  Maybe you summed it up perfectly and nobody has anything left to say.   :happy3:

Or another thought - ssshhhh...maybe nobody will notice it.   :wink3:

Okay, James kinda started it off but I've decided to let scripture speak for itself and let everyone decide what it means

Jeremiah 10:23 - "Lord, I know that none of us are in charge of our own destiny;
    none of us have control over our own life."

I see this very similarly to EW.  Gods will is Gods will...we can not thwart that. I believe that within that will, is Gods desire to educate our spirits through our limited will...where we can make choices and educate our spirits with such choices.


--- Quote from: ded2daworld on October 28, 2012, 06:40:01 AM ---Okay, James kinda started it off but I've decided to let scripture speak for itself and let everyone decide what it means

Jeremiah 10:23 - "Lord, I know that none of us are in charge of our own destiny;
    none of us have control over our own life."

--- End quote ---

(23)O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps. (24)O LORD, correct me, but with judgment; not in thine anger, lest thou bring me to nothing.
(Jer 10:23-24)

The scriptures do speak for themselves, but we interpret them as we will ;o) With the following verse, it appears that Jeremiah is speaking of correction, which is connected to the exercise of will. A reasonable perspective on verse 23 could be that man cannot find His destiny without correction and direction- as opposed to, for instance, absolute control. Therefore it behooves us, as Jeremiah does in verse 24, to pray for correction.


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