Author Topic: The 70 weeks and 70 AD  (Read 7267 times)

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HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2010, 04:27:26 AM »
That dose indeed depend on which Gospel you are talking about,
Well-message... GoodNews of What???

Because If anyone cant admit that there is more than one message of Good News spoken of in the bible, Then there not ready to hear that truth in the first place.
Lee

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2010, 04:31:03 AM »
                                        THE WORD "GOSPEL"

The word "gospel" or "evangel" means, literally, WELL- MESSAGE, glad tidings, or good news. It is so familiar to us all that we have come to accept its application as uniform to us, without question. This is a source of serious confusion, and a form of teaching by which Christendom has suffered untold spiritual loss.

In the Scriptures we read of "the gospel of the kingdom," "the gospel of the kingdom of God," "the gospel of the Circumcision," "the gospel of the Uncircumcision," "the gospel of the grace of God," "the gospel of God," "the gospel of the glory of the happy God," Paul's "my gospel," "the gospel of Christ," "the gospel of the glory of Christ," "the mystery of the gospel," "a different gospel, which is not another," and "the everlasting [eonian] gospel."

To the majority of God's saints, preachers, and teachers included, it is taken for granted that all these expressions refer to one and the same thing--simply the gospel! I humbly acknowledge that, for a long time it was my portion to exercise just such poor workmanship in the service of the Lord, and all due to blindly following traditions! But when, by His grace, I was led to make a conscientious study of the Scriptures through a "pattern of sound words," giving heed to the significance of every expression, my entire ministry was changed.

By not giving consideration to the admonitions of the Scripture to distinguish the things which differ and "rightly divide the word of truth," we find many preaching a gospel which is now in "abeyance," or for the future, or they mix the teachings of two or more, thereby producing "a different gospel, which is not another"--a perverted gospel, the teacher of which, though he be an angel from heaven, lies under the double anathema of the Scriptures!

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2010, 04:36:16 AM »
                                THE DIFFERENT GOSPELS

The various references in the Scriptures to the evangels find expression under five different headings: (1) The Gospel of the Circumcision, (2) The Gospel of the Uncircumcision, (3) The Mystery of the Gospel, (4) A Different Gospel, which is Not Another, and (5) The Everlasting (Eonian) Gospel. We now propose to carefully consider each of these gospels in our study, partitioning them to those whom the Scriptures clearly designate.

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #28 on: January 03, 2010, 04:38:12 AM »
                          I. THE GOSPEL OF THE CIRCUMCISION

The Scriptures speak of "the gospel of the Circumcision," and, to make no mistake here, we will appeal to the Scriptures for information as to who the Circumcision are, then we shall ascertain the gospel which belongs to them. The first mention of the subject should settle the matter for one and all.

    And God is saying to Abraham: "Now you shall keep My covenant, you and your seed after you for their generations. This is My covenant which you shall keep, between Me and you and your seed after you: Every male of you is to be circumcised. And you are to be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskin: it becomes a sign of the covenant between Me and you. And a son of eight days shall be circumcised by you--every male of your generations, he who is born of the house and he who is purchased with money from a foreigner, who is not from your seed. He who is born in your house and he who is purchased with your money shall be circumcised to be circumcised, and My covenant comes to be in your flesh for an eonian covenant. And the uncircumcised male who shall not be circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin, that soul is cut off from his people: he frustrates My covenant" (Gen.17:9-14, tentative C. V.).

Let us hear Paul:

    Wherefore, be remembering that once you, the nations in flesh--who are being termed Uncircumcision by those being termed Circumcision, in flesh, made with hands--that in that era you were apart from Christ, being alienated from the citizenship of Israel, and guests of the promise covenants, having no expectation, and without God in the world (Eph.2:11,12).

These scriptures will suffice to show that the seed of Abraham according to the flesh, every male of which is circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin, is the Circumcision. In the second place, the gospel which concerned them, their promise covenants, Messiah and kingdom, most assuredly was "the gospel of the Circumcision." Scriptural affirmation on this is made by Paul to the Galatians, saying:

    But on the contrary, perceiving that I have been entrusted with the evangel of the Uncircumcision, according as Peter of the Circumcision (for He Who operates in Peter for the apostleship of the Circumcision operates in me for the nations) (Gal.2:7,8).

Here we learn that Peter was entrusted with the gospel of the Circumcision, and that God operated in Him for the apostleship of the Circumcision. But where did this take place? The answer is found back in the closing days of our Lord's earthly ministry to the Circumcision (Rom.15:8). As we have pointed out before, in the thirteenth of Matthew, when the nation of Israel the elders and chiefs of the people, the rulers and builders--rejected Messiah's message, He quotes Isaiah's solemn words and closes the door of the kingdom against them. He then tells the disciples the "secrets of the kingdom of the heavens," events which are to transpire after His crucifixion and resurrection. This is followed by a significant event in the sixteenth chapter of Matthew, which is little understood unless we strictly apply it to whom it belongs. Bear in mind that Christ was not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel, that He became a servant of the Circumcision for the sake of the truth of God, to confirm the patriarchal promises, and, that He went everywhere preaching the gospel of the kingdom. After His proclamation is rejected and the door is locked, we find Him committing to Peter the "keys of the kingdom of the heavens," with the authority of unlocking and binding and loosing with the assurance that his acts will be ratified in heaven (Matt.16:18,19). It is amusing, were it not so lamentably serious, the way preachers of today assume that this declaration of the Lord Jesus to Peter applies with equal force to them!

The Lord committed the keys of the kingdom of the heavens to Peter, and with him "the eleven" (Matt.18:18), but to no others. This is the time when Peter was entrusted with the gospel of the Circumcision. This can be none other than "the gospel of the kingdom of the heavens" (Matt.3:2; cp 4:23), which was originally heralded by John the baptist:

    Declaration came down the whole of Judea, beginning from Galilee with the baptism which John proclaims: Jesus from Nazareth, as God anoints Him with holy spirit and power, Who passed through as a benefactor and healer of all those who are tyrannized over by the Slanderer, seeing that God is with Him (Acts 10:37,38).

It is the good news that the God of the heavens has purposed to set up a kingdom, right here on earth, both political and spiritual, embracing all the kingdoms of men "under the whole heavens," Messiah ben David to sit on the throne of His father according to the Davidic promise (2 Sam.7:1-16), Jerusalem to be the capital city, rebuilt with gloriously resplendent beauty, the sons of Israel possessing the kingdom, with all peoples, lands, and countries subject to them as priests of Jehovah and ministers of God, when they shall reign until the knowledge of the glory of Jehovah shall cover the earth as the waters form a covering for the sea. It concerns the good news that Jehovah is going to fulfill the patriarchal promise and restore the kingdom to Israel, the political sovereignty of which was taken away from them and given to the gentiles, beginning with Nebuchadnezzar, "until the eras of the nations may be fulfilled" (Luke 21:24).

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #29 on: January 03, 2010, 04:39:05 AM »
                        THREE PREACHINGS OF THIS GOSPEL

The Scriptures set forth three proclamations of this gospel of the kingdom"--two past and one future. The first began with the "pre-proclamation of John the baptist from Galilee" (Acts 10:37), and continued with the ministry of Christ and His disciples, ending with His transformation on the holy mount, after He had been rejected by the builders of the nation (Matt.13:14,15; Acts 13:23-27).

The second began on the day of Pentecost, when Peter, using the keys which had been entrusted to him, standing up with the eleven, proclaims to the whole house of Israel...that God makes Him Lord as well as Christ--this Jesus Whom they crucify!" (Acts 2:36). The twelve begin the ministry in Jerusalem, and it goes to entire Judea and Samaria, then to the limits of the land. This is as far as the Pentecostal commission (Acts 1:8) through the twelve extended, the full account of which we have given in the eighth chapter. Paul was called outside the land and commissioned to carry it to those of the dispersion. But, like that of Messiah and the twelve in the land, it was rejected. The door of the kingdom is once again swung shut for the second time by Isaiah's solemn message, at the close of the book of Acts (28:26-28), and the kingdom and kingdom proclamation go into abeyance.

Just here it will not be out of place to emphasize the truth that Israel is still set aside as a nation, until the full measure of the nations be come in (Rom.11:25-27). Paul says, "...judging this, that if One died for the sake of all, consequently all died" (2 Cor.5:14). Upon the same basis we press the fact that if the nation of Israel, as such, is broken off, calloused, blinded, in the purpose of God, until the full complement of the nations may be entering, then, all that pertained to them--their promise covenants, priests, King and kingdom, the gospel of the kingdom, the epistles written directly to them, as such, are all, most assuredly held in abeyance with them. Therefore, to preach the Circumcision gospel of the kingdom today is to preach a gospel which is strictly concerned with Israel and their kingdom, and now set in suspense until other purposes are fulfilled in God's eonian administrations. The truth of all this is markedly demonstrated to all who will give conscientious attention to what is written.

There is to be, however, a third proclamation of the gospel of the kingdom in the future, after the ecclesia which is the body of Christ has been completed and assembled unto our Lord, Life, and Head among the celestials. It will be during the administration of "future indignation" (Matt.3:7), and "the great affliction" (Matt.24:10-22), which covers the last half of the seventieth seven of Daniel's seventy-sevens prophecy (Dan.9:24-27). See chart in Chapter VI. The proclamation will be carried on by a faithful remnant of Israel, to whom faith and mercy will be shown after the full complement of the nations may be entering (Rom.11:29-32). The Lord Jesus told of it in connection with the great affliction of Israel, by the nations, in the end-time, saying,

    And this evangel of the kingdom shall be proclaimed in the whole inhabited earth for a testimony to the nations, and then the consummation shall be arriving (Matt.24:3-14).

The entire context shows the Lord's message here is concerned with the sons of Israel in contrast with the nations; the nations hating, persecuting and killing, them because of Christ's name, yet a faithful remnant in the midst of the great affliction proclaiming the evangel of the kingdom for a testimony to all the nations, then "the end of the world" or the "present wicked eon" shall be arriving, when Messiah shall come and bring deliverance to Israel, usher in the coming eon and confirm the covenant and kingdom to them according as it is written.

The loud and persistent cry of "back to the old Jerusalem gospel" as a standard motto of fidelity to the truth today, is little realized to be, in reality, a slogan for apostasy! It may sound good to those who emphasize it, but it ignores what is written and goes back and pillages from the promises of others!

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #30 on: January 03, 2010, 04:39:44 AM »
                         II. THE GOSPEL OF THE UNCIRCUMCISION

No doubt the question pressing for attention now is, How can we know the gospels for today? To this, we propose to let the one divinely chosen, called, severed by the holy spirit and commissioned with a peculiar message for the nations in this administration of the secret, give the answer. Some twenty times the Scriptures speak of Paul as a herald and an apostle and a teacher of the nations in knowledge and truth (2 Tim.1:11).

After his conversion, as Saul, he was associated with those apostles who were called directly from Judaism--the twelve--and, for the Acts period, he proclaimed the gospel of the kingdom in the synagogues outside the land to those in the dispersion--Jews and proselytes.

In the thirteenth chapter of Acts, we read of his severance for the work whereunto he was called; and, as Paul, he goes to the nations, preaching his first message direct to the nations at Psidian Antioch, where he makes the first mention of his grand doctrine of justification, the peculiar gospel for which he was severed, and which he delighted to call "my gospel." However, it must be borne in mind that Paul, as we have pointed out in Chapter VII, from his severance in Acts thirteen, carried on a two-fold ministry until the conclusion of the Acts period. In the synagogues, outside the land, he proclaims the evangel of the kingdom as a witness to the Jews and gentile proselytes gathered there. After being driven out, he preached the gospel of God-- justification by faith--to all who would listen to him, Jew and gentile alike (Acts 13:2; Rom.1:2; Gal.1:11,12; Rom.1:16,17; 3: 21-26; and 4:25-5:1,2).

Let it be remembered, however, that this gospel-- justification by faith--was never preached by the twelve. At this point, comes all the confusion. By mixing the gospel of the kingdom (which carries pardon, or forgiveness), with the gospel of the grace of God (which carries justification, acquittal, and vindication), there is produced "a different gospel, which is not another," an adulterated gospel with an anathema for all who preach it!

After Paul and Barnabas had preached the evangel in Lystra and Derbe and the country round about, "Some coming down from Judea, taught the brethren that, `If you should not be circumcised after the custom of Moses you cannot be saved'" (Acts 15:6). After quite a commotion and questioning with them, in accord with the decision of the brethren in Antioch and a special revelation, Paul goes up to Jerusalem and submits to those of repute the evangel which he is proclaiming among the nations (Gal.2:2).

From Paul's account of this meeting, in his Galatian epistle, we learn that

    not even for an hour do we simulate by subjection, that the truth of the evangel may continue with you (Gal.2:5).

On the other hand, Paul obtained the fullest recognition of his apostleship from those of repute, as he recounts to the Galatian brethren:

    Now from those reputed to be somewhat (what kind they once were is of no consequence at all to me--God is not taken up with the human aspect) for those of repute submitted nothing to me. But, on the contrary, perceiving that I have been entrusted with the evangel of the Uncircumcision, according as Peter of the Circumcision (for He Who operates in Peter for the apostleship of the Circumcision operates in me also for the nations), and knowing the grace which is being given to me, James and Cephas and John, who are supposed to be pillars, give me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, that we, indeed, are to be for the nations, yet they for the Circumcision (Gal.2:6-9).

At this meeting, James (not the apostle), the Lord's brother, having assumed headship of the Jerusalem ecclesia, decides to make decrees and send them to those among the nations who have believed (Acts 15:19-32). Paul and Barnabas with others are sent forth with these decrees. Presently a sharp dissension arises between Paul and Barnabas. Paul chooses Silas, and being given over to the grace of God by the brethren (Acts 15:40), soon hears the Macedonian call and goes to new fields.

From this time until the close of the Acts period, there is on ever-widening distinction between the ecclesia (out-called) from the Circumcision and the ecclesia from among the Uncircumcision. Paul, as we learn from his epistles, is preaching "the evangel of God...concerning His Son" for which he was severed "for faith obedience among all the nations for His name's sake" (Rom.1:1-6), which he, terms "the evangel which is being preached by me" (Gal.1:11), "the evangel which I preach among the nations" (Gal.2:1), "my evangel" (Rom. 2:16; 16:25; 2 Tim.2:8).

This is, of course, "the evangel of the grace of God" given only to the apostle Paul to certify. It is the good news that Christ, rejected and crucified, was made a sin offering for the world, that He was roused from among the dead because of our justification, and through the deliverance which God wrought in Him, through faith in His blood, we are justified from all things, and may be having peace, and may glory in expectation of the glory of God. Nothing like this is found in the writings of the Circumcision.

This evangel is described in many ways. It is called "the evangel of God" in Romans 1:1, because it originates in His love; "the evangel of Christ" in 2 Corinthians 10:4, because it flows from His sacrifice, and because He is the sole object of gospel faith. It is called "the evangel of the grace of God" in Acts 20: 24, because it saves those whom the law curses, and justifies those to whom no promises or covenants were ever made. It is called "the evangel of the glory of Christ" in 2 Corinthians 4:4, because it concerns Him Who left His preeminent place in glory, emptied Himself, took on the form of a slave, coming to be in the likeness of humanity, humbles Himself, becoming obedient unto death, even the death of the cross, wherefore, God has exalted Him at His right hand in glory

    up above every sovereignty and authority and power and dominion and every name that is named, not only in this eon, but in that which is future, also, and subjects all under His feet, and gives Him the headship over all to the ecclesia which is His body, the complement which is completing the entire universe (Eph.1:21-23).

It is called "the evangel of our salvation" (Eph.1:13), because it is God's "power for salvation to every one who is believing" (Rom.1:16). It is called "the evangel of the Uncircumcision" (Gal.2:7), because it saves wholly and apart from all works, forms, and ordinances--Paul being the called apostle and chosen dispenser of it "for faith obedience among all the nations, for His name's sake" (Rom.1:5).

The "gospel of the Uncircumcision" together with the "mystery of the gospel" is the evangel that should be preached today.

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2010, 04:40:22 AM »
                         III. THE MYSTERY OF THE GOSPEL

This secret phase is almost totally lost in Christendom today. In fact, outside of those acquainted with the CONCORDANT VERSION OF THE SACRED SCRIPTURES, very few know anything about it, and fewer still are preaching it. When Martin Luther broke the shackles of Romanism, he restored to the world Paul's grand doctrine of justification by faith. We emphasize again, that this is "the gospel of God" for which Paul was severed, and which he called "my gospel," and was never preached by Peter, James, John, or any of the twelve, and neither is it to be found in any of the Circumcision writings.

The scriptural doctrine of justification is not very well understood by the saints today. Usually it is degraded to a mere pardon or forgiveness, which is very poor workmanship, to say the least! We must use care and clearly sever it from "the gospel of the Circumcision" if we hope to get the heart-satisfying message God has been pleased to give forth through it. Justification is God's own righteousness, which He lavishes upon the sinner for faith (Phil.3:9). But "the mystery of the gospel" was a secret until made known through the apostle Paul by revelation. It is termed by the Scriptures the "conciliation," and is concerned with peace.

Our common, or King James version has completely glossed over this glorious truth, until it is indeed a "mystery" in Christendom! We find that in the original, God used two words to express the different aspects of this evangel, but our translators ignored the fact and rendered both "reconciliation." Consequently the blessed truth of the "conciliation" was lost to the saints.

In the Greek we have two words: katallassoo, meaning DOWN-CHANGE, or "conciliate," and apo-katalassoo, meaning FROM-DOWN-CHANGE, or "reconcile." Consequently it should be evident to all that God was expressing two different ideas by using two words, and furthermore, the truth is clearly borne out by the contexts in which the words are used. Conciliation is a one-sided affair always.

    Yet all is of God, Who conciliates us to Himself through Christ (2 Cor.5:18).

    Being enemies, we were conciliated to God through the death of His Son (Rom.5:10).

In the "secret of the evangel," we find that "all is of God," Who is conciliated Himself, and is beseeching the sinner to be conciliated. When the sinner lays down his arms, puts away his enmity, and receives God's conciliation, made by the death of His Son on the cross, there is mutual reconciliation and peace.

Let us remember that
Christ Died for Sinners:    God's Son Died for Enemies:
Yet God is recommending this
love of His to us, seeing that
while we are still sinners,
Christ died for our sakes
(Rom.6:8,9).    For if, being enemies, we were
conciliated to God through the
death of His Son, much rather,
being conciliated, we shall be
saved through His life (Rom. 5:10).
   Justification,
        Righteousness
             Salvation!       Conciliation,
        Love,
             Peace!

"Many of the saints have never known the stability, the solid satisfaction, the exultant joy which justification itself cannot produce, but which comes to those who use the Way God has provided--Christ Jesus--not only to unburden their sins, but as the road leading to His very presence, giving admission to this far greater grace--the reconciliation.

"Justification flows from that which God has done; but the basis of peace is what He is. We point to the deliverance which is in Christ Jesus as the ground of our justification, righteousness, and salvation. But we must look up to the Son of God, exalted to the highest glory, beyond the reach of death, and to God Himself, Whose Image He is, and find in Him the living, heart-satisfying, everlasting ground of conciliation, love and peace.

"The Son of God, though the same Person as Christ, presents Him in a distinct exalted light. Messiah is the Man Who can; He is the power of God, His strong right arm. His anointing fits Him to do things. The Son of God speaks not so much of God's Executive as His Image. What God is shines forth in Him. Dwelling in the bosom of the Father, He reveals His affections toward His creatures.

"Unless we distinguish between the various glories of our Lord Christ, we shall lose much, very much, indeed.

"As the Son of God, His death does not furnish either strength or righteousness, but supplies the long-lost love link which was left behind in the gloomy retreat from Eden. By all means let us exult in our justification by the death of Christ and the security sealed by His blood. But this is only a means to a glorious end. If we stop here, we fail to reach God's purpose in it all.

"We were conciliated through the death of His Son! This speaks not of our weakness or our sins or anything of ourselves. It tells us of God's side of that wondrous transaction on Calvary. When men killed God's Son, He reckoned not their offenses against them, but made it a conciliation whereby mankind and God could be reconciled and at peace. Let us, preach Christ for sinners;

God's Son for enemies! Christ for righteousness; God's Son for conciliation! The blood of Christ for salvation; the life of God's Son for love, mutual reconciliation and peace!" (Excerpts from "The Mystery of the Gospel").

This is termed in the Scriptures "the mystery of the gospel," and was hushed during the eonian times until revealed through the apostle Paul for the present secret administration of God's grace (Rom.2:16; 16:25; Eph.6:18-20; 2 Tim.2:8). The entire twelfth chapter is devoted to a study of this evangel.

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2010, 04:41:04 AM »
                   IV. A DIFFERENT GOSPEL, WHICH IS NOT ANOTHER

This gospel is solemnly laid on the hearts of all who read conscientiously the opening chapter of Paul's epistle to the Galatians. The epistle was called forth as a result of Jewish teachers visiting ecclesias of the nations in the Galatian province where Paul had been evangelizing, who tried to get them to circumcise and be zealous for the law, according to the practice under the Circumcision gospel. It is the mixing of the teachings of one or more gospels and zeal for the law that produces this "different gospel which is not another." How refreshing to meet a man who gives no place to tradition, but ever seeks to know the will of God through His Word, and preaches that Word in fervent love with an eye single unto the glory of our blessed Lord Christ!

THE APOSTASY OF CHRISTENDOM

Paul in writing to the Thessalonians admonished them that "No one should be deluding you by any means, for should not the apostasy be coming first." Many are already deluded in looking for a movement to come and destroy the Bible, because of which, religious faith and zeal will cease! Nothing could be further from revealed truth than this. The end of this eon is going to see one of the most gigantic organizations of religion the world has yet known, in which faith and religious zeal will be gained by "power and signs and false miracles," when the whole earth will be worshiping! Just now I opened a letter in my morning mail, from a large denominational organization, lamenting the fact that "we have lost our Bible- school vision and our evangelistic fervor!" As a solution for the condition they urge that if we will "specialize, advertise, mobilize and Bibleize, the victory will come!" We may be assured that there will be no end to the cry for "Bibleizing," "Bible- school rallies," "evangelistic meetings" to "indoctrinate our people, both young and old, in our position." All who have entered into the realization of God's eonian purpose, particularly His revelation concerning the closing of this wicked eon, know that neither money nor energy will be spared to keep these organizations alive; for they must grow and federate into a world system of religion, to which allegiance and homage must be paid to the head or suffer death as the consequence! But we should remember that organization and religion is not Christ and salvation! Here is where the delusion and apostasy has come in. Furthermore, the apostasy of which Paul speaks is not with the minority--the few who refuse to subscribe to the various denominations of religion, but with the majority--the vast federated systems of religion with their millions of communicants is the apostasy!

The question now arises, What constitutes the apostasy of Christendom? The Scriptures give the answer. During the Acts period, Paul not only witnesses to the "gospel of the kingdom" in the synagogues outside the land of Palestine, but preaches the "gospel of the grace of God" to all who would listen, Jews and gentiles alike. In his last missionary journey we find him in Miletus, pleading with the elders of the Ephesian ecclesia, rehearsing to them how he had "certified the evangel of the grace of God," and for three years, night and day, he admonished each one with tears, and now, again, commits them to God and the "Word of His grace." A few years later, to Timothy, he writes his final epistle, and gives forth the lamentable words: "Of this you are aware, that all those in the province of Asia turned from me" (2 Tim.1:15). To whom and to what did they turn? There is but one answer, They turned away from Paul's teaching to that of the Circumcision! That was the beginning of the apostasy which organized Christendom has propagated until this day. Seventy-five per cent of the Bible teachings, upon which the different denominations claim to be founded, are drawn from the Circumcision writings, not a word of which was ever written to them! The writings of Paul, the one specially called, severed and commissioned as the apostle, herald, and teacher of the gentiles in knowledge and truth, are given scarcely any place whatever! As they turned from Paul in that early day, so have they turned from him and the knowledge and truth God has ordained for them today!

But I hear some one resorting to the usual confident argument, O, we take Paul's writings together with all the others! But how little those making this argument realize that they are indicting themselves of preaching "a different gospel, which is not another," and placing themselves under the anathema of the Scriptures!

It is not enough to cry loud and long for specializing, mobilizing, and Bibleizing. We must give heed to what has been written through a pattern of sound words, distinguishing the things which differ and rightly divide the Word of truth if we expect to stand before God qualified, unashamed workers and receive His blessed applause.

God has severed the "gospel of the Uncircumcision" from the "gospel of the Circumcision," and has placed in them that which cannot be mixed without producing an adulterated gospel, which the Scriptures term "a different gospel, which is not another." It is simply joining together that which God has severed, and His anathema is on all who do such, though they be an angel from heaven.

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #33 on: January 03, 2010, 04:41:49 AM »
                        V. THE EVERLASTING (EONIAN) GOSPEL

The "everlasting [literally, eonian] evangel" is spoken of but one time in the Scriptures, and it is worthy of our closest consideration in connection with the time and circumstances to which it is related.

    And I perceived another messenger flying in mid-heaven, having an eonian evangel to preach to those situated on the earth, and to every nation and tribe and language and people, saying with a loud voice, "Fear ye God and be giving glory to Him, seeing that the hour of His judgment came, and worship the Maker of heaven and land and sea and springs of water" (Rev.14: 6,7).

This eonian evangel is not for today, as all may perceive, if they will but read discriminatingly. It is for the hour of His judgment, and that is in the future day of His wrath. God is conciliated and at peace with the world today, and all true preaching should harmonize with our commission as ambassadors proclaiming the word of the conciliation--peace (2 Cor.5:18- 21). This eonian evangel is proclaimed in the midst of wrath, and does not call upon them to believe as the evangel of today does. In fact, there seems to be no faith connected with it, for it is adapted for a time when grace is withdrawn. It does not call for repentance, for that is the door into the kingdom before the hour of judgment has struck (Acts 2:38). We find the burden of the message to be fear--the fear of God in His most elemental character as Creator. It is a demand that no one be worshiped but the One Who created the universe. It is a counter message to the false prophet, who is calling on all to worship the wild-beast and the dragon, as may be learned by comparing it with Revelation 13: 11-15. The message applies in the latter part of Daniel's seventieth seven (See Chart, Chapter VII), the closing part of the awful tribulation when God's indignation is to be visited undiluted upon the sons of Stubbornness. The message reveals that God remembers mercy even in the time of indignation.

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2010, 04:46:36 AM »
SUMMARY

I. The Gospel of the Circumcision is the good news in accord with the patriarchal promises, to restore the kingdom to Israel, embracing all the kingdoms of men under the whole heavens, with Messiah sitting on the throne of His glory in Jerusalem, and Israel a royal priesthood--kings to rule the nations, and priests to minister Jehovah's spiritual blessings unto them.

II. The Gospel of the Uncircumcision is the evangel of the grace of God for which Paul was severed. It offers justification --God's own righteousness--to the sinner, for faith obedience in Christ Jesus, apart from law, forms, and ordinances. Paul spoke of it as "the gospel which I am proclaiming among the nations"--"my gospel."

III. The Mystery of the Gospel is the conciliation offered in the death of God's own Son for reconciliation and peace. It was a secret hushed during the eonian times, until revealed through the apostle Paul for the present secret administration of grace.

IV. A Different Gospel, which is Not Another, is an adulterated evangel, brought about by mixing the "gospel of the grace of God" with the "Circumcision gospel" of the kingdom and zeal for the law, and holds forth a double anathema on man or angel who is guilty of preaching thus.

V. The Everlasting (Eonian) Gospel is for the hour of judgment in the future day of indignation, calling on all those situated on the earth to fear God, and give Him glory and worship as Creator. It is a counter message to that of the false prophet which calls on mankind to worship the image of the wild-beast and receive the mark in their forehead and hand. It is contrary to all facts of revelation to propose the proclamation of such an evangel in this day of grace.

And Doug, I know you wont waste your time with this truth.
Lee

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #35 on: January 03, 2010, 05:29:17 AM »
SUMMARY

I. The Gospel of the Circumcision is the good news in accord with the patriarchal promises, to restore the kingdom to Israel, embracing all the kingdoms of men under the whole heavens, with Messiah sitting on the throne of His glory in Jerusalem, and Israel a royal priesthood--kings to rule the nations, and priests to minister Jehovah's spiritual blessings unto them.

II. The Gospel of the Uncircumcision is the evangel of the grace of God for which Paul was severed. It offers justification --God's own righteousness--to the sinner, for faith obedience in Christ Jesus, apart from law, forms, and ordinances. Paul spoke of it as "the gospel which I am proclaiming among the nations"--"my gospel."

III. The Mystery of the Gospel is the conciliation offered in the death of God's own Son for reconciliation and peace. It was a secret hushed during the eonian times, until revealed through the apostle Paul for the present secret administration of grace.

IV. A Different Gospel, which is Not Another, is an adulterated evangel, brought about by mixing the "gospel of the grace of God" with the "Circumcision gospel" of the kingdom and zeal for the law, and holds forth a double anathema on man or angel who is guilty of preaching thus.

V. The Everlasting (Eonian) Gospel is for the hour of judgment in the future day of indignation, calling on all those situated on the earth to fear God, and give Him glory and worship as Creator. It is a counter message to that of the false prophet which calls on mankind to worship the image of the wild-beast and receive the mark in their forehead and hand. It is contrary to all facts of revelation to propose the proclamation of such an evangel in this day of grace.

And Doug, I know you wont waste your time with this truth.
Lee


Adlai Loudy followed the teachings of John N. Darby and E. W. Bullinger and others, and became confused, Lee. He beame an ultradispensationalist.

These look a lot like his teachings from GOD'S EONIAN PURPOSE.

Revelation 14:6
And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people.


How many angels does it take, to preach the gospel? One.

One Gospel is preached to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people. One gospel for both Jew and Gentile.

Mr. Loudy was deceived. He taught that the Christians of Gentile nationality have a different destiny than those of the Jewish race. It was a false gospel of racism. His theory is thwarted by the message of Jesus to the church of Thyatira.

Revelation 2:26-29
26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
28 And I will give him the morning star.
29 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.


Jesus promised those who overcome power over the nations, and "the morning star." This is both earthly and heavenly or "celestial.:Sparkletooth:

We know Matthew, John, Peter, and the other apostles are in the kingdom of God, and scripture says their names are in the holy city. But we don't know whether Mr. Loudy will be with them, do we? He didn't believe he would be.

Doug

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #36 on: January 03, 2010, 05:46:06 AM »
                                THE DIFFERENT GOSPELS

The various references in the Scriptures to the evangels find expression under five different headings: (1) The Gospel of the Circumcision, (2) The Gospel of the Uncircumcision, (3) The Mystery of the Gospel, (4) A Different Gospel, which is Not Another, and (5) The Everlasting (Eonian) Gospel. We now propose to carefully consider each of these gospels in our study, partitioning them to those whom the Scriptures clearly designate.

Adlai Loudy's errors were exposed by H.A. Ironside in
 Wrongly Dividing the Word of Truth

 ULTRA-DISPENSATIONALISM EXAMINED IN THE LIGHT OF HOLY SCRIPTURE

Doug

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #37 on: January 03, 2010, 06:08:51 AM »

Let us hear Paul:

    Wherefore, be remembering that once you, the nations in flesh--who are being termed Uncircumcision by those being termed Circumcision, in flesh, made with hands--that in that era you were apart from Christ, being alienated from the citizenship of Israel, and guests of the promise covenants, having no expectation, and without God in the world (Eph.2:11,12).

These scriptures will suffice to show that the seed of Abraham according to the flesh, every male of which is circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin, is the Circumcision. In the second place, the gospel which concerned them, their promise covenants, Messiah and kingdom, most assuredly was "the gospel of the Circumcision." Scriptural affirmation on this is made by Paul to the Galatians, saying:

    But on the contrary, perceiving that I have been entrusted with the evangel of the Uncircumcision, according as Peter of the Circumcision (for He Who operates in Peter for the apostleship of the Circumcision operates in me for the nations) (Gal.2:7,8).

Here we learn that Peter was entrusted with the gospel of the Circumcision, and that God operated in Him for the apostleship of the Circumcision. But where did this take place? The answer is found back in the closing days of our Lord's earthly ministry to the Circumcision (Rom.15:8). As we have pointed out before, in the thirteenth of Matthew, when the nation of Israel the elders and chiefs of the people, the rulers and builders--rejected Messiah's message, He quotes Isaiah's solemn words and closes the door of the kingdom against them. He then tells the disciples the "secrets of the kingdom of the heavens," events which are to transpire after His crucifixion and resurrection. This is followed by a significant event in the sixteenth chapter of Matthew, which is little understood unless we strictly apply it to whom it belongs. Bear in mind that Christ was not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel, that He became a servant of the Circumcision for the sake of the truth of God, to confirm the patriarchal promises, and, that He went everywhere preaching the gospel of the kingdom.


Paul wrote to the Philippian Christians,

Philippians 3:3
For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.


Oops! That pops Adlai's bubble!

This too:

Colossians 2:10-12
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.


Peter must have ministered to the Philippians and the Colossians, since he was entrusted with the gospel of the Circumcision.

Wait! Paul said this:

Romans 15:8-9
8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:
9 And that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy; as it is written, For this cause I will confess to thee among the Gentiles, and sing unto thy name.


The mercy of God was shown to Gentiles, because they could be included in the promises with the circumcision by faith in Christ!

Doug

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #38 on: January 03, 2010, 06:44:12 AM »
                         III. THE MYSTERY OF THE GOSPEL

This secret phase is almost totally lost in Christendom today. In fact, outside of those acquainted with the CONCORDANT VERSION OF THE SACRED SCRIPTURES, very few know anything about it, and fewer still are preaching it. When Martin Luther broke the shackles of Romanism, he restored to the world Paul's grand doctrine of justification by faith. We emphasize again, that this is "the gospel of God" for which Paul was severed, and which he called "my gospel," and was never preached by Peter, James, John, or any of the twelve, and neither is it to be found in any of the Circumcision writings.

The scriptural doctrine of justification is not very well understood by the saints today. Usually it is degraded to a mere pardon or forgiveness, which is very poor workmanship, to say the least! We must use care and clearly sever it from "the gospel of the Circumcision" if we hope to get the heart-satisfying message God has been pleased to give forth through it. Justification is God's own righteousness, which He lavishes upon the sinner for faith (Phil.3:9). But "the mystery of the gospel" was a secret until made known through the apostle Paul by revelation. It is termed by the Scriptures the "conciliation," and is concerned with peace.


The apostle Peter was the one chosen by God to first bring the gospel to the family of a Gentile centurian named Cornelius. Mr. Loudy ignores the circumtances of this event. It is fatal to his flawed interpretation.

Acts 15:7-11
7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
11 But we believe that through the grace of the LORD Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.


Peter says that God put "no difference between us and them."

IMO, Mr. Loudy misunderstands, and so he has embraced a distorted "gospel," such as the apostle Paul would have condemned, Galatians 1:8-9. Peter believed that he was saved through the grace of the LORD Jesus Christ. He did not believe in salvation by the works of the law, etc. And the same applies to the other apostles and saints. He said the Gentile saints were saved by grace, the same as Jewish saints!

Eschew ultradispensationalism!

Doug

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #39 on: January 03, 2010, 02:49:12 PM »
Hmm.. The problem is, according to hebcal.com, the passover in that year was March 24, which was a Monday, so that year cannot be the year of the crucifixion. Oops!
Full moon was on March 27. (See teh disclaimer on the top of that calendar site)
Plus the calculated day is only part of the story as any Rabi will tell you.

Using data from the Fourmilab calculator:

Hebrew date: 3791 Nisan 14

Gregorian: 31 AD March 24 Monday

Julian: 31 AD March 26 Monday

Nisan 14 was the Passover day. The full moon was the day following, the first day of the feast, and a "high day."

Jesus could not have been crucified in 31 AD. The astronomical and calendar data supports the year 30 AD as more likely being the year of the crucifixion.

Both Gospel and war lasted 7 years.
Quote from: Doug
Nonsense! The gospel still goes to everyone, both Jews and Gentiles.
Really? The Jesus' disciples are still walking around and teaching?

Jesus still confirms his covenant with his saints!

The 70th week is not finished yet.

Doug

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #40 on: January 03, 2010, 02:57:33 PM »
Doug, I will tell you what I will do for the sake of understanding. I will read Ironside link, its a lot, so give the a few days. And I "will not say you are Wrong", Although I do want to ask a few things, and state a few things to "you" but in here others read this and learn good or bad. So these Questions are to you.

Which did you learn (read about first) Loudy or people against like Ironside??

____________________________________________________________

Did you ever read Loudy's story about Cornelius that was written by him? or did you read Ironside's story about Loudy's error of Cornelius? (first)?
I beg you to answer these question honestly...
explanition of Loudy= he does not believe what you said, that is a commentary of what someone says that he believes, (My Commentary) i.e. he believes that All will at some point in time be IN God, as they say, in the end.
All will be ALL IN all.   Israel will All be saved and come to God in the end. He just says it the way the original Bible says it in the original words, which is confusing to most to understand that God DID have a way for his first Chosen people to get the Kingdom of Heaven to come. It had to be forfilled , He had to come to the earth First...And his first chosen did not see or want it His way, they wanted things their way which isn't God's way. The plan of God is and was and did happen the way God wanted, first that God would bring His kingdom to Humankind through a Saviour and that person was His Son, Jesus The Anointed of the Father. And that if anyone actknowledged and worked with the Faith that was given to everyone and work at building your own faith on what was first give by God then All will be saved by the Faith Given By God and worked out by man in this earth life, and to those that don't work out that faith given, then they will be saved in another age, or Time if you will.

Loudy believed that All would be save... there IS just different ways in which God works with humankind and peoples.

I believe it really does hang on what YOU learned to understand " first"

Loudy or Ironside.      Truth seeker or debunker of 4 mentioned

While I am reading Ironside, few days please, push the quote button and highlight areas to comment on and answer the above please and I will go back and check it when I get time, I am busy for the next few days stripping. (Floors)

With All due Respect Lee Damboise II

Offline sheila

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #41 on: January 03, 2010, 05:19:33 PM »
Signs of the end of the AGE   Matthew 24

 v 36  The DAY AND HOUR UNKNOWN 

   No-one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in

heaven, nor the son, BUT ONLY THE FATHER

   As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be t the coming of

the son of man.....

  v 40 two men will be in the feild,one will be taken and one left

 v 42 Therefore, keep watch!! because you do not know on what

day your Lord will come

  Matthew 25  Parable of the ten virgins...five wise, five foolish

 testifies of woman of folly/babylon woman of wisdom

[seperation]

  Parable of talents..increase in spiritual growth[ one talent is

ministry of death/judgement/tokogae] two talents free gift of

grace added to judgemnet[mercy][or if you like ministry of

death taken away[law]...of the increasing of His Kingdom there

is no end.....thus  5+5  parable of ten virgings, parable of ten

talents=righteous judgement..all men condemned for sin in

flesh, all men given free gift of eternal life through Christ

  Parable of sheep and goats..again seperation of people from

what God rejects...this theme plays out through all scriptures

Jacob/Esau...in evry choice of linage to the promised seed...

  God's favour is evident... I will have mercy on who I have

mercy

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #42 on: January 03, 2010, 07:49:12 PM »
Doug,

I am on my way to work, but I started reading Ironside's Bull story, I have to admit that is really explains so much, thanks and I will get back to you when I insert "my comments to it for you" It will take a few days please forgive the delay, working this week.

Lee Damboise II

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #43 on: January 03, 2010, 07:59:46 PM »
Quote from: Doug
Hebrew date: 3791 Nisan 14
Gregorian: 31 AD March 24 Monday
Julian: 31 AD March 26 Monday
Read the intro at the top: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/phase/phasecat.html
And for a little extra info: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SEhelp/calendar.html
And: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SEhelp/dates.html
So the Julian and Gregorian year always  differ 1 year.


Perhaps you misread the sources you link to above.
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_calendar

The Julian calendar was in general use in Europe and Northern Africa from the times of the Roman Empire until 1582, when Pope Gregory XIII promulgated the Gregorian Calendar. Reform was required because too many leap days are added with respect to the astronomical seasons on the Julian scheme. On average, the astronomical solstices and the equinoxes advance by about 11 minutes per year against the Julian year. As a result, the calculated date of Easter gradually moved out of phase with the March equinox. While Hipparchus and presumably Sosigenes were aware of the discrepancy, although not of its correct value, it was evidently felt to be of little importance at the time of the Julian reform. However, it accumulated significantly over time: the Julian calendar gained a day about every 134 years. By 1582, it was ten days out of alignment from where it supposedly was in 325 during the Council of Nicaea.

The Gregorian Calendar was soon adopted by most Catholic countries (e.g. Spain, Portugal, Poland, most of Italy). Protestant countries followed later, and the countries of Eastern Europe even later. In the British Empire (including the American colonies), Wednesday 2 September 1752 was followed by Thursday 14 September 1752. For 12 years from 1700 Sweden used a modified Julian Calendar, and adopted the Gregorian calendar in 1753, but Russia remained on the Julian calendar until 1917, after the Russian Revolution (which is thus called the "October Revolution" though it occurred in Gregorian November), while Greece continued to use it until 1923. During this time the Julian calendar continued to diverge from the Gregorian. In 1700 the difference became 11 days; in 1800, 12; and in 1900, 13, where it will stay until 2100.


The difference between Julian and Gregorian dates is currently 13 days, not 1 year.

Plus: "There is some historical uncertainty as to which years from 43 BCE to 8 CE were counted as leap years." introduces even more uncertianty.
So great care has to be taken with the Gregorian calender. And of course no mix up Julian with Gregorian years.

There is general agreement amongst scholars, and scientists, about the date of the full moon in the year 31 AD. It is not really confused, as you seem to be trying to suggest.

Here is another calendar site. The link shows the entire year 31 AD, and the dates of all the new, half, and full moons are stated for each month. This is the Julian calendar. In either the Julian or Gregorian calendars, the day of the week and the lunar cycles can be determined accurately. The full moon in March in the year 31 AD in Israel occurred on a Tuesday, and so Passover would be on the previous day, a Monday. That rules out 31 AD as the year of the crucifixion. 

Three independent calendar sites refute your claims! Want more?  :laughing7:

Doug

Offline CHB

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #44 on: January 04, 2010, 03:36:27 AM »

Quote from: Lee Damboise
This secret phase is almost totally lost in Christendom today. In fact, outside of those acquainted with the CONCORDANT VERSION OF THE SACRED SCRIPTURES, very few know anything about it, and fewer still are preaching it. When Martin Luther broke the shackles of Romanism, he restored to the world Paul's grand doctrine of justification by faith. We emphasize again, that this is "the gospel of God" for which Paul was severed, and which he called "my gospel," and was never preached by Peter, James, John, or any of the twelve, and neither is it to be found in any of the Circumcision writings.

Lee,

This is so true. Even Paul wasn't allowed to preach it much. Paul keep asking for prayer that he might be able to preach it the way he wanted to but preaching this is what got him thrown into prison.

CHB

Offline Cardinal

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #45 on: January 04, 2010, 05:16:26 AM »
 :cloud9: Lee.....Seems to me I recall reading some pretty horrible statements about Martin Luther's comments about the Jews. Since the Spirit is not divided, I wonder how it is possible that he could have "superior" revelation regarding covenant, along side such an apparent hatred of the Jewish people?

Especially since a JEW died for us all, as He was born under the law it said, and He wept over Jerusalem because they knew not the time of the visitation of THEIR Messiah. These are the sort of things I ponder........Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #46 on: January 04, 2010, 05:08:20 PM »
Truly sorry to say I know almost nothing about Luther.

Lee

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #47 on: October 09, 2011, 12:54:58 AM »
I found a different interpretation of the 70 weeks. The 70 weeks don't point to Jesus at all. Not His first and not His second coming.
It points to 2 Messiahs
1] Nehemiah
502BC
7 weeks is 49 years.

2] Hyrcanus/John/Johanan
68BC
62 weeks is 434 years.
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=1004&letter=H

Neh 12 [ACV]
22 As for the Levites, in the days of Eliashib, Joiada, and Johanan, and Jaddua, there were recorded the heads of fathers, also the priests, in the reign of Darius the Persian.

Picture
e-book
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #48 on: October 09, 2011, 02:11:31 AM »

The "second coming" is fallacy and never should be portrayed by the Sons of God.

Doug

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Re: The 70 weeks and 70 AD
« Reply #49 on: October 09, 2011, 06:25:55 AM »

The "second coming" is fallacy and never should be portrayed by the Sons of God.

Really?

Jesus said,

John 14:3
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Hebrews 9:28
So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

Doug