Author Topic: Prophecy  (Read 193108 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 4006
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #775 on: October 09, 2012, 06:50:41 AM »
Quote from: eaglesway
Actually, Doug's post included it and mine referred to it.


as a part of God's plan the Jews have been blinded, for our benefit,  and at the time of the end, when the fulfillment of the Gentiles has happened, the Jews will be brought back into the fold.

THIS is what Paul is talking about in Romans [9,10]11.  In Romans 11 he is very clear, Jesus will return, and they will be saved.  This is the promise God made to the tribe of Judah.  Romans 11 is an end time prophecy.  It is not yet happened.


I'm not real involved in this thread, but I totally agree.  It's the Plan of the Ages.  I don't care to explain it by labels or try to put it in some eschatological category, but according to my understanding of the scriptures.

 First Israel (throughout the OT and beginning of the New, pre-cross).
 After the cross, the elect of the Gentiles (plus a few Jews as part of the elect who are given eyes to see) while the rest are blinded;  "..their minds were hardened, for unto this day the same vail at the reading of the Old Covenant doth remain unwithdrawn..".  Only in Christ is that veil removed, and yet according to the Jewish religion, Yashua is not (as yet) seen as the Messiah. 
 Within that elect, those few given faith to believe in this age, there is neither Jew nor Gentile; both alive and having become one in Christ. His body.   
 Time of Gentiles fulfilled, all Israel saved.
Blessings.

 I agree with Romans 11;25 entirely, and Romans 9 and Galatians 3 and 4. IT HAS BEGUN and IS HAPPENING- it is just not yet FULFILLED. ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED. Of course- eventually EVERYONE will be saved. The plan of the ages requires more stages and we all know that this is not the last age. IMO,The ONE NEW MAN(Eph 4, Rev 12, that will come out of the woman will be the priesthood that reconciles the rest of Israel and the rest of all mankind. However, it remains to be seen what that salvation entails and how it will transpire- we arent given the details.

In this age it is about this:

But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father. Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
(Eph 2:13-22)

There we see again Colossians "And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven. "
(Col 1:20)

Ephesians 2:16 .....that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross

STAGE ONE OF THE RECONCILIATION OF ALL THINGS IS THE CHURCH,  which is the Body and the One New Man- Jew and Gentile. The remaining stages are seen through a glass darkly.

This also has ALREADY BEGUN but is NOT YET FULFILLED. If you want a prophetic time clock, another good one is WATCH The CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST. When she BEGINS TO GLOW and TRAVAIL then you know that the end is near so REJOICE, GO UP ON THE ROOF, LOOK UP! Ephesians 4 is just as prophetic as anything else as far as I am concerned.

And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
(Eph 4:11-16)

Notice to whom the promises Jesus makes in the book of revelations are made. "To Him who overcomes". Figuring out who the devil is or who the anti-Christ is is not overcoming. Understanding what the Bride of Christ is and getting CLEANED AND PRESSED, is overcoming (How else will we get to be "without spot wrinkle or blemish" :Pray:).

If you think about it, as you said Molly, Daniel and Revelation are about the "time of the end"- the end of this age, we have been in it for a while and will be in it for a while more. But also Daniel and Revelation are about the Bride and the Overcomers

Almost EVERY WORD JESUS SPEAKS TO JOHN IS FOR THE BRIDE AND THE OVERCOMERS. The rest of His words are to EXHORT THOSE WHO ARE FALLING AWAY TO REPENT. THE PRE-EMINENT PURPOSE OF THIS AGE IS THE PREISTHOOD, the ONE NEW MAN, the CITY OF GOD- ALL OF THESE ARE ABOUT THE RECONCILIATION OF THE REST OF THE CREATION(ROMANS 8).

We talk in heated tones about how people are back slid and not ready etc etc. I don't kno if we realize that the body of Christ is the ark of the Lord in these last days. What deliverance there is will be in the house of God for those who are in the secret place of the Most High. For others there will be grace to "do exploits"--- in that portion of Daniel it also says that people will join them(the people who kno their God) in hypocrisy, Why? Because of the power and presence of Gd in the midst. For others there will be grace to "lay down their lives" when the great purges of Christians begins again. The plan of the ages IS NOW for everyone and always has been. So- are we to debate what WILL BE? as we always do? (Tell us Lord, When cometh the kingdom to Israel?) or will we PRESS IN TO WHAT IS NOW, the glory of God in the tabernacle of the Spirit, living stones, fitly joined together in the bond of peace and the mortar of brotherly love- ah, there is the rub, for that to happen we must GET HOLD of what we need to be GOTTEN HOLD OF :o) (Draw nigh unto God and He will draw nigh unto you)

Think about it, where did the persecutions occur. WHERE THE CHURCH WAS WALKING IN VICTORY!

It will be the manifestation of the body of Christ in glory under the Headship of Jesus in the latter rain that will PROVOKE the prophecies we speak of as if it is all about the devil and the forces of Anti Christ, but IT IS NOT. It is a revelation of GOD, VICTORIOUS IN HIS PEOPLE, the MANFESTATION OF TRUTH ARISING TO MEET HIM IN CLOUDS OF GLORY.

You see this played out OVER AND OVER. The reign of Jehoshaphat.....AFTER the RESTORATION OF ISRAEL under his righteous reign, ALL THE ARMIES OF THE CANAANITES SURROUNDED JEruSALEM......... the reign of Hezekiah, AFTER THE RESTORATION OF ISRAEL under his righteous reign, the ASSYRIANS under BENHADAD came and surrounded the HOLY CITY and Rabshekah breathed out threats against the Lord and His people......

IMO, It will be AFTER THE GLORY RETURNS TO THE TEMPLE(of living stones) that we will see most of the final literal fulfillments of the prophecies concerning this age- WHICH IS ABOUT THE CHURCH :o)




The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #776 on: October 09, 2012, 07:06:35 AM »
Wallid Shoebat on the harlot with mystery Babylon on her forehead:



the beast is the governmental aspect of this antichrist empire.  the beast therefore would be the caliphate.

the harlot woman city is the spiritual driver of this beast mechanism=mystery babylon

she is the spiritual source that influences these different ethnic peoples

In Isaiah 21 Babylon is described as the desert by the sea

she sits in a literal desert

the harlot is a provider of wine that intoxicates the nations [rev 17:2]

she holds this wine in a chalice

the kings of the earth commit adultery with her

she is drunk with the blood of the saints

this prostitute woman is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth [rev 17]

she exists geographically in a desert region

what wine intoxicates the earth?  what desert nation is the geographical womb where this false harlot religion was birthed? 

he proposes that the harlot uses both islam and oil as her wine through which she seduces the nations of the world into committing spiritual adultery with her and compromising Israel.

rev 18  she is judged because of her maddening influence on those who partake of her adulterous doctrines.  the religion of the harlot has the same effect as the oil, the financial dimension--the world is addicted to oil.

the merchants of the earth have grown rich on the abundance of her delicacies [rev 18]

Isa 34 Its streams shall be turned into pitch and its dust into brimstone; its land shall become burning pitch.  It shall not be quenched night or day; its smoke shall ascend forever.

Isaiah predicts the burning of pitch=crude oil.   No simile.  Its land becomes burning pitch. 

the harlot city in rev 18--the kings of the earth shall lament for her when they see the smoke of her burning. 

Jer 51:7 babylon was a golden cup in the LORD's hand that made all the earth drunk.  The nations drank her wine; therefore, the nations are deranged.

God makes her drink from the very cup she used to establish her power.  She will be burned in one hour.  She will fall.  The kings of the earth will weep for her oil.

 This judgment extends from Teman to Dedan [Arabia]--Eze 25:12, 13

She will be consumed by fire.  woe woe O great city, Babylon, in one hour your doom has come.=rev 18

The judment on the harlot is permanent.  All signs of human habitation will be permanently eliminated.  It will be a home for demons=rev 18

Jer 50:39   desert creatures and hyenas will live there

Isa 34:14  it will be a habitation of jackals.

The destruction of Babylon will be absolute.  I will sweep it with the broom of destruction Isa 12:15--> sounds nuclear

Rev 18 tells us that the beast hates the harlot.  It will ultimately turn on her, killing her, devouring her, and burning her body with fire. 

The beast and the ten horns you saw will hate the prostitute.  They will bring her to ruin and leave her naked; they will eat her flesh and burn her with fire.  Rev 18

The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth.  Rev 17

Would muslims destroy Mecca?  Yes, they have before.  Turks and Persians resent Arab imperialism.    The prophecy implies that a coalition of radical muslims will destroy Arabia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjHzBK7UtRg



« Last Edit: October 09, 2012, 07:13:21 AM by Molly »

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 4006
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #777 on: October 09, 2012, 07:22:16 AM »
Walliet makes some great points, but the wine the harlot drinks is the blood of the saints, I think he is definitely wrong on that point.

And I saw the woman drunk with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the witnesses of Jesus. When I saw her, I wondered greatly.
(Rev 17:6)
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #778 on: October 09, 2012, 07:24:58 AM »
Walliet makes some great points, but the wine the harlot drinks is the blood of the saints, I think he is definitely wrong on that point.

And I saw the woman drunk with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the witnesses of Jesus. When I saw her, I wondered greatly.
(Rev 17:6)
Yes, he says both--she controls both islam and oil--the wine is both the blood of the saints and literal crude oil.

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 4006
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #779 on: October 09, 2012, 07:41:25 AM »
I would say Rome(-vatican RC) is the harlot(or a primary historical manifestation of her), and that Europe is the beast(same). The harlot, the "queen of heaven", rode the beast for a millennium, while making herself drunk on the blood of the saints and the wine of her immorality(wealth and power), but for several hundred years now, the beast has been eating the harlot, who now no longer rides anyone, but has been "consumed" into the 666 system, as have all her daughter harlots, because she is the mother of harlots, under a head of gold(papal authority)

The only thing that makes me hold back on that is the prophecy that her fall will come in one hour before the whole world- that doesnt fit, so abide the possibility of a further manifestation of her to come, but she could still be Rome- events could yet swing THAT way, should a charismatic, dynamic, spiritually empowered pope arise I would be raising an eyebrow at that.
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12895
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #780 on: October 09, 2012, 08:48:25 AM »
Europa is a name from Greek mythology:
http://www.greekmythology.com/Myths/The_Myths/Zeus_s_Lovers/Europa_/europa_.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_(mythology)

Europa was abducted by Zeus who had taken the form of a bull.
Bull=beast.....????
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #781 on: October 09, 2012, 09:12:59 AM »
I would say Rome(-vatican RC) is the harlot(or a primary historical manifestation of her), and that Europe is the beast(same). The harlot, the "queen of heaven", rode the beast for a millennium, while making herself drunk on the blood of the saints and the wine of her immorality(wealth and power), but for several hundred years now, the beast has been eating the harlot, who now no longer rides anyone, but has been "consumed" into the 666 system, as have all her daughter harlots, because she is the mother of harlots, under a head of gold(papal authority)

The only thing that makes me hold back on that is the prophecy that her fall will come in one hour before the whole world- that doesnt fit, so abide the possibility of a further manifestation of her to come, but she could still be Rome- events could yet swing THAT way, should a charismatic, dynamic, spiritually empowered pope arise I would be raising an eyebrow at that.

If Rome falls in one hour, it will not affect me in the slightest way--in terms of how my life or even my day will go on as usual. I would weep over her the way I would weep over any tragedy to my fellow humans, but not the way those in Rev 18 are weeping because their whole world is ending. 

  If oil were no longer available or 20 dollars a gallon, on the other hand, that would ruin my day and change my life forever.

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #782 on: October 09, 2012, 09:16:24 AM »
A nice digression... :cloud9:



Heaven Is Real: A Doctor's Experience With the Afterlife
Oct 8, 2012 1:00 AM EDT

When a neurosurgeon found himself in a coma, he experienced things he never thought possible—a journey to the afterlife.


Although I considered myself a faithful Christian, I was so more in name than in actual belief. I didn't begrudge those who wanted to believe that Jesus was more than simply a good man who had suffered at the hands of the world. I sympathized deeply with those who wanted to believe that there was a God somewhere out there who loved us unconditionally. In fact, I envied such people the security that those beliefs no doubt provided. But as a scientist, I simply knew better than to believe them myself.

In the fall of 2008, however,...



http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/10/07/proof-of-heaven-a-doctor-s-experience-with-the-afterlife.html

Offline reFORMer

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 1943
  • Gender: Male
  • Psalm 133
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #783 on: October 09, 2012, 09:16:53 AM »
The 7 hills are on the other side of the Tiber from Rome.  She doesn't sit on them unless by contrivance of maps; but, much of that used to indict Rome as Babylon indicts the Mother Jerusalem, and the old city does sit on 7 hills.  (The 7 names I've posted here before.)  The same thing happened to the Church as to Israel.  They were meant to be God's Priesthood to the rest of humanity.  Instead, they were taken captive by the head of gold, a political entity Jesus calls, "Gentile authority."  The mother and daughters are Jerusalem and the Institutional churches.  Rome and Eastern Orthodox are older daughters.  Many are in intimacy with these institutions in ways we are only meant to be with God.  Many do not allow being led of the Spirit, but follow ritual and they have other mediators.  Their doctrines are the traditions of men, rather than the voice of the Living Jesus singing in the midst of His people.
________________________________________

I like all insights I can get on this marvelous "Unveiling."  If I write something about some portion, don't assume that is all I know or believe, nor is it conclusive.  I want more.  I like preterism, historicism, futurism, and the several branches of symbolism.  Because there are so many things never stated in scripture which are essential to dipSINsationalism, I particularly dislike it as a system of interpretation for anything.  One of its cardinal points is racism which was abolished by Jesus death on the cross.  Particularly evil is its view of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, that they belong to those of a certain racial identity, and are not operative for other races in the Church.  It is more insidious "modernism" than German higher criticism because it pretends to believe in scripture, just that is not for us.  Those who believe in the workings of the Spirit in our present time enjoy His manifestation as surely as anytime in the past.

May I also mention that you should not get your clues from steeple houses whose manner of meeting refuses the directly communicated headship of Jesus Christ through each and every one of the members in particular and stops the gifts and blessings in the body of Christ from functioning, replacing them with a professional speaker.  We must exercise to our own spiritual development and the edifying of the body gathered.  Those who accept audience status, atrophy, falling far short of the corporate and individual "Perfect Man" the Holy Spirit is committed to produce.  Many of us have to function outside such meetings in pursuit of "The measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ."
________________________________________

As best as I am aware, nowhere does the Book of Revelation call itself sealed up or closed 'til the time of the end, unlike Daniel.  There is a scroll the Lamb unseals which I understand as the Eclessia, His bride.  As He unseals her, releases her, all creation begins to change.  When He begins to read out loud what He has written there, a new creation begins to rise unveiled.

Then there is also a little scroll John ate.  It really changes him.  It is unlikely you'll want to chase it down to read it, if you even can.  He'll tell you all about it though.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2012, 09:32:15 AM by reFORMer »
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #784 on: October 09, 2012, 09:29:30 AM »
Quote from: reformer
As best as I am aware, nowhere does the Book of Revelation call itself sealed up or closed 'til the time of the end, unlike Daniel.

It's clear it is sealed, because it says it is sealed and because no one can open it.

And, since it is the Lord's day that John is experiencing in the Spirit, it is the time of the end when someone does finally open it.





And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

--Rev 5

Offline reFORMer

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 1943
  • Gender: Male
  • Psalm 133
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #785 on: October 09, 2012, 09:50:03 AM »
Quote from: reformer
As best as I am aware, nowhere does the Book of Revelation call itself sealed up or closed 'til the time of the end, unlike Daniel.

It's clear it is sealed, because it says it is sealed and because no one can open it.

And, since it is the Lord's day that John is experiencing in the Spirit, it is the time of the end when someone does finally open it.





And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals.

2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?

3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon.

5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

--Rev 5

There is nothing said in the text about the scroll with the 7 seals being the Book of the Revelation or vice versa.  It is an interesting thought; however, without Biblical warrant, a direct quotation stating it, I shouldn't hold to such an assumption.  Without going into it any more right now, I just shared in my previous post what has stood for several decades as a good functional understanding of this mystery.  There's a whole book in the Bible permeated with the premise that God's people in apostasy are exiled to Babylon:  Zachariah, who married a daughter of whoredoms, seeks her when she is deported away from the prophet.  Both Isaiah and John the Revelator called Jerusalem and Judea, Sodom and Egypt.  Certainly "Babylon" is very important.  Babylon occurs 294 times in 260 verses.  After Christ, it has 3 times as many mentions in scripture as the next prophetic topic.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2012, 10:27:30 AM by reFORMer »
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Paul L

  • Est
  • *
  • Posts: 259
  • Gender: Male
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #786 on: October 09, 2012, 03:04:36 PM »
Molly,

Quote
We see in the very next chapter of Daniel, the reference to "the time of the end."   There is no controversy about this.  Everyone agrees this is referring to the end of the age.

We're not talking about the next chapter, the point of discussion is your use of the bogus translations that use "some" & "few" in Dan 11:6.

Quote
After some years, they will become allies.   Dan 11:6

Only if you like bogus translating.


Quote
So here in Daniel 11:6 we see a bit of discretion used by the translators.

You mean deliberate mistranslations...... . From the original Chaldee/Hebrew "end of years" is the only intellectually viable translation.

 
Quote
They alternatively translate  "after some years, "  "some years later,"  "in the end of years,"  "after a few years,""at the end of some years," and "after the end of years."

Doesn't matter what their opinions are about their bogus translating, it's all about what God states he inspired to be written.

Quote
You can see from the words used and the context why they use their discretion.  But, it all means the same thing--after a period of years, the king and the daughter of the other king get together.

Dead on wrong. Where does God state anywhere in his Holy Writ that he has given it unto men the latitude of using their "discretion" about what words to use in their translations? I actually know of a prophetic statement that condemns the practice you support, Rev 22:19.  Does that scripture sound to you as if God allows men to have a wide latitude of "discretion" regarding God's own Holy Writ?

To come up with the translation you want, two Chaldee/Hebrew words need to be inserted into the text:

Strong's #310 achar: after(ward)
Strong's # 428 elleh: these or those

The fact neither one of these words appear in the text of Dan 11:6 is proof that your favored translators simply made up two or three different words with much different definitions in Hebrew & English & bogusly inserted them without warrant.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2012, 04:11:00 PM by Paul L »

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #787 on: October 09, 2012, 04:10:50 PM »
Quote from: Paul
"end of years"

well if you are going to be like that, it doesn't say "end of years" either.  It doesn't say "And in the end of years" as your preferred translation says.  It is two words, so take your pick

"End years" [they joined themselves together]

or

"After years" [they joined themselves together].


Neither one of those meanings implies the end times or the end of the age.  That's a different two words which doesn't include the word "years."

The translator always has total discretion over his translation, and will add words and pick meanings to smoothly translate from one language into another.  No two languages have a direct one to one correlation, and the preservation of the meaning within the context is up to the translator.




2Ch 18:2 And after7093 [certain] years 8141 he went down 3381 to Ahab 256 to Samaria 8111. And Ahab 256 killed 2076 sheep 6629 and oxen 1241 for him in abundance 7230, and for the people 5971 that [he had] with him, and persuaded 5496 him to go up 5927 [with him] to Ramothgilead 7433 1568.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2012, 04:45:41 PM by Molly »

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3582
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #788 on: October 09, 2012, 06:39:06 PM »
 ...Look to me and be saved....ALL YE ENDS OF THE EARTH......that day and hour no man knows...

  neither the son....But only the Father.

   at the END OF CHRIST'S REIGN= This is the end of the day of Christ and the perfecting of the saints...

   when He turns the kingdom over unto the Father that the Father may be ALL IN ALL[now pay close attention

  you that 'hear" the message of 'ALL SAVED".......for we are there........

  He that has been restrained is let loose from the abyss to go forth= He that now restrains is taken out of the way

   how so? when the angel comes down and binds him/ he is restraining him........ when  satan released

  Christ's kingdom/day taken out of way[churches overcome/  litte camp of Holy city remnant in earth

   this is the 'end' of the Day of the Lord..and when darkness comes/satan...the hour of darkness or power of it

    You see...the day of Christ is intnded to bring to perfection/manchild sons of maturity.......then the kingdom

  is turned over to the Father...who then releases satan to go forth to fight against the camp of the Holy city

  and completely wipeout all enemies at that time

    the sixth trumpet is the releasing of the bound angels at the great river Euphrates...or he that now rstrains

  taken out of the way........

   now some of these things I'm saying may need to be 'refined somewhat" but am typing as receiving.......

   


Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 4006
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #789 on: October 10, 2012, 02:18:07 AM »
The book is unsealed by the Lamb for John, and at the end of the book John is instructed NOT to seal it for the time is at hand


Revelation 22:10
Then he told me, "Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this scroll, because the time is near.
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline Paul L

  • Est
  • *
  • Posts: 259
  • Gender: Male
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #790 on: October 10, 2012, 02:41:02 AM »
Molly, read on:

Quote
well if you are going to be like that, it doesn't say "end of years" either.  It doesn't say "And in the end of years" as your preferred translation says.  It is two words, so take your pick

Quote
"End years" [they joined themselves together]

And you are absolutely correct on this point, so go back & look at my previous post, it reads: "end of years", if you noticed, I did not place "of" in bold letter form. I did this for the express purpose of reminding myself that even the use for the word "of" is also not warranted in the translation.

Quote
or

Quote
"After years" [they joined themselves together].

This is bogus translating


Quote
Neither one of those meanings implies the end times or the end of the age.  That's a different two words which doesn't include the word "years."

And what are those two words?

Quote
The translator always has total discretion over his translation, and will add words and pick meanings to smoothly translate from one language into another.  No two languages have a direct one to one correlation, and the preservation of the meaning within the context is up to the translator.

Talk about a stretch..... using that kind of reasoning, you should have no problem  translating John 3:16 : "God so hated the world........"

Seriously for a moment. Are you aware of the various manuscripts that exist which counter your every word? The Septuagint & Dead Sea scrolls are in perfect accord with the Greek & Aramaic/Hebrew writ of the words which open Dan 11:6, and the literal translation of the text is inarguable, the most mechanical translation from the Septuagint that I've known about for a long time reads as follows:

"Now at the end of years they shall join......."

The bold letters are direct transliteration from the Greek Septuagint text, confirmed in the Masoretic Text & the Dead sea scrolls, that the above as I have written in bold letters is an exact transliteration into English. This is to say, for each word as it appears in the original manuscripts there is an exact word for word translation and exact definition in the English language as I have placed in boldface above & previous post. The letters I left in light face were added by translators to smooth the flow from Greek to English.

Do you want to drop "of" that is between "end" & "years"? I have no problem with that, then you get: "In the end years.....", which is a better translation as far as I'm concerned, use for the word "of" is completely pointless as far as I can see. Drop "of" and the case is further bolstered that the text is pointing the reader to a specific period in time that remains future to us, the "end years", the 70th week of Daniel's prophecy.





« Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 02:49:07 AM by Paul L »

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 4006
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #791 on: October 10, 2012, 02:58:04 AM »
Problem is, end times in Daniel, the word time or times is "ayth" and it is not year. It is used nearly 300 times in the OT for  wide variety of specific periods, most of which IN NO WAY mean year.

Strong's Hebrew 6256,
294 Occurrences


Gen 21:22 : Now it came about at that time(ayth) that Abimelech

Ex 9:18 :  Behold, about this time(ayth) tomorrow,


Deut 1:18 : And I commanded you at that time(ayth) all the things


Deut 28:12 :  unto thy land in his season(ayth), and to bless
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #792 on: October 10, 2012, 03:51:19 AM »
Quote
Do you want to drop "of" that is between "end" & "years"? I have no problem with that, then you get: "In the end years.....",

Paul, really, I have explained it as well as I can to you.  This is now officially a waste of my time.

Two words.  Do with them what you want.  As far as I'm concerned, it is not referring to the end times.  It already happened.


H7093
קץ
qêts
kates
Contracted from H7112; an extremity; adverbially (with prepositional prefix) after: -  + after, (utmost) border, end, [in-] finite, X process.



H8141
שׁנה    שׁנה
shâneh  shânâh
shaw-neh', shaw-naw'
(The first form being in plural only, the second form being feminine); from H8138; a year (as a revolution of time): -  + whole age, X long, + old, year (X -ly).


"After years"

Offline Paul L

  • Est
  • *
  • Posts: 259
  • Gender: Male
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #793 on: October 10, 2012, 04:06:26 AM »
Problem is, end times in Daniel, the word time or times is "ayth" and it is not year. It is used nearly 300 times in the OT for  wide variety of specific periods, most of which IN NO WAY mean year.

Strong's Hebrew 6256,
294 Occurrences


Gen 21:22 : Now it came about at that time(ayth) that Abimelech

Ex 9:18 :  Behold, about this time(ayth) tomorrow,


Deut 1:18 : And I commanded you at that time(ayth) all the things


Deut 28:12 :  unto thy land in his season(ayth), and to bless

This is all Hebrew text you are referring to. The book of Daniel was not written in Hebrew, it originally came from the Chaldee texts, thus carrying Chaldee definitions, not Hebrew definitions. Your point about "ayth" has no usefulness here.

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 4006
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #794 on: October 10, 2012, 04:51:46 AM »
Daniel was written in Hebrew and Chaldee. According to Scofield the Chaldean section is chapter 2:4 - 7:28, in which case the Hebrew would be in force for Daniel 11:35

"The language returns to Hebrew in the predictive portions which have to do with the future of Israel. 'The Hebrew of Daniel is closely related to that of Ezekiel.'"--Delitzsch.

http://lexiconcordance.com/hebrew/6256.html

http://bible.cc/daniel/2-4.htm

In which case, "years" would not apply
« Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 05:56:52 AM by eaglesway »
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #795 on: October 10, 2012, 05:41:43 AM »
WND EXCLUSIVE
Obama's ring: 'There is no god but Allah'

He's worn it on his wedding-ring finger since before he met Michelle

Published: 2 hours ago

NEW YORK – As a student at Harvard Law School, then-bachelor Barack Obama's practice of wearing a gold band on his wedding-ring finger puzzled his colleagues.

Now, newly published photographs of Obama from the 1980s show that the ring Obama wore on his wedding-ring finger as an unmarried student is the same ring Michelle Robinson put on his finger at the couple's wedding ceremony in 1992.


Moreover, according to Arabic-language and Islamic experts, the ring Obama has been wearing for more than 30 years is adorned with the first part of the Islamic declaration of faith, the Shahada: "There is no God except Allah."

The Shahada is the first of the Five Pillars of Islam, expressing the two fundamental beliefs that make a person a Muslim: There is no god but Allah, and Muhammad is Allah's prophet.

Sincere recitation of the Shahada is the sole requirement for becoming a Muslim, as it expresses a person's rejection of all other gods




http://www.wnd.com/2012/10/obamas-ring-there-is-no-god-but-allah/

Offline reFORMer

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 1943
  • Gender: Male
  • Psalm 133
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #796 on: October 10, 2012, 08:52:50 AM »
So, both Isaiah and John (in Revelation) says Jerusalem is Sodom and Egypt.  The Book of Zechariah is about Jerusalem being a whore.  Both ancient Israel (of earthly Jerusalem) and early Christianity (God's heavenly Jerusalem) fell away into captivity to Babylon.  What else is needed to understand this much about Mystical Babylon?
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #797 on: October 10, 2012, 09:22:36 AM »
Is Jerusalem in a desert?  Because Babylon is.

Does any of this describe Jerusalem, past or present?


Then the angel carried me away in the Spirit into a desert. There I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast that was covered with blasphemous names and had seven heads and ten horns.  Rev 17:3

Revelation 17:5 This title was written on her forehead: MYSTERY BABYLON THE GREAT THE MOTHER OF PROSTITUTES AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.


Revelation 17:2 With her the kings of the earth committed adultery and the inhabitants of the earth were intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries."


15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues






Jerusalem's Unique Climate
by Larry Vardiman, Ph.D.

Several years ago a Jewish meteorologist from Tel Aviv University, Pinhas Alpert, began to ponder Psalm 48:1,2 which describes Jerusalem. "Great is the Lord, and greatly to be praised is the city of our God, in the mountain of His holiness. Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole Earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the north, the city of the great King." He found that the original word in Hebrew which was translated as "situation" is the word "nof." It appears only once in the whole Bible and its explanation is not straightforward. In modern Hebrew, nof, means environment, panorama, or landscape observed from a high elevation or from a distance. Alpert (1991) was surprised to find that one commentator suggested the word just means "climate," and that Jerusalem's climate is beautiful. This article is intended to show that Jerusalem indeed has a unique and beautiful climate—one which not only is a special blessing of the Lord on all who live there, but also to those who visit, whether for business or pleasure.

An Ideal Combination of Sun and Rain
Most people think of Israel as a desert. They have seen pictures and drawings of caravans of camels tramping through the sand of the Sahara Desert and translate that image to Israel. They have read Bible stories about Jesus and His disciples walking across Israel in their sandals and the need for foot washing, the lack of water, and famine. They have seen Hollywood movies depicting the time of Moses and the Exodus in the deserts of Egypt and the lower Sinai. All these images give an impression of extremely hot, sunny conditions and very little, if any, rain.

It is true that very dry conditions exist in southern Israel in the Negev and eastward of the Jordan River Valley. However, along the central and northern coast in northern Israel near the Sea of Galilee, and along the highlands on which Jerusalem sits, temperatures are much cooler and bountiful rainfall occurs. The average annual rainfall in northern Israel and along the highlands typically exceeds 15 inches. These portions of Israel produce plentiful crops of citrus, olives, figs, and grain. Far from being a desert, this part of Israel is highly productive.

What are the conditions which create an ideal climate? Most people would say that lots of sunshine would be preferable, but only if the temperatures don't become too high. Also, the sunshine should not be so prevalent that no clouds and rain ever occur. The climate of a desert would not be considered ideal by most people because it is too dry and hot. Neither would a tropical climate be considered ideal because it is too humid. So, a mix of lots of sun with a moderate amount of clouds and rain would seem to be the most desirable.

The amount of sunshine and rain that Jerusalem receives seems to meet these criteria exactly. Figure 1 shows the amount of sunshine received at 69 weather stations around the earth on the x-axis and the amount of precipitation in millimeters per year on the vertical axis. A vertical line at 3250 hours of annual sunshine and a horizontal line at 300 millimeters of annual rainfall divide the chart into quadrants. Notice that two stations in Jerusalem fall alone in the upper right-hand quadrant of this diagram with a large amount of sunshine and a moderate amount of rain occur. The only other station which approaches these ideal conditions is Flagstaff, Arizona, which is at a considerably higher, cooler elevation than Jerusalem.

The Climate of Israel in the Past
The climate of Israel may not have always been as warm and dry as it is today. Several references in Scripture would seem to imply that the land was wetter in the past and more suitable for agriculture without the need for irrigation than that which is prevalent in the Middle East now. For example,

And Lot lifted up his eyes, and beheld all the plain of Jordan, that it was well watered everywhere, before the LORD destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah, even as the garden of the LORD, like the land of Egypt, as thou comest unto Zoar (Genesis 13:10).

And the LORD said, I have surely seen the affliction of my people which are in Egypt, and have heard their cry by reason of their taskmasters; for I know their sorrows; And I am come down to deliver them out of the hand of the Egyptians, and to bring them up out of that land unto a good land and a large, unto a land flowing with milk and honey (Exodus 3:7,8).

.....



Today's Beautiful Climate
Jerusalem today, however, seems to have a generally uniform climate and is in a specially favored location to experience an ideal climate. It is not too hot, not too cold, not too dry, not too wet. The climate in Jerusalem truly bears out Scripture which says, "Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the north, the city of the great King" (Psalm 48:2).

http://www.icr.org/article/jerusalems-unique-climate/

Offline reFORMer

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 1943
  • Gender: Male
  • Psalm 133
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #798 on: October 10, 2012, 09:27:43 AM »
(It seems as though I'm speaking in tongues without an interpreter)


You are speaking in the outer court.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 09:32:02 AM by reFORMer »
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11247
Re: Prophecy
« Reply #799 on: October 10, 2012, 10:16:02 AM »
Here, Babylon is called, 'the land of the Chaldeans."



Jer 50:1 The word which the Lord spoke concerning Babylon, the land of the Chaldeans, through Jeremiah the prophet...3 "For a nation has come up against her out of the north ; it will make her land an object of horror, and there will be no inhabitant in it.


again, sounds nuclear.






The Chaldeans were an Arabic tribe that migrated out of the Arabian peninsula in the eighth century BCE, to settle in the region just to the south of the city of Babylon at a time when it was under Assyrian domination. They eventually overthrew the Assyrian rulers, to establish the neo-Babylonian kingdom.

Additional information

The country of Chadea was an ancient land in southern Babylonia, on the Persian Gulf near the delta of the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. In biblical times the name was applied to all of Babylonia. As far as can be traced, the Chaldeans themselves descend from Shem's son, Arphaxad, who is also an ancestor of Abraham and Israel.
The Chaldeans lived in the southern portion of the Babylon on the rich land by the Tigris and Euphrates rivers. Ur, the hometown of Abraham, was it's most recognizable city in ancient times.(Genesis 11:28, 31; 15:7; Nehemiah 9:7; Acts 7:2-4) .
Eventually all Babylonia became known as "the land of the Chaldeans" and the Bible prophesied that it would rise to a World Power and fall again (Isaiah 13:19; 23:13; 47:1, 5; 48:14, 20, 2Kings 24:1, 2; 2Chronicles 36:17; Ezra 5:12; Jeremiah 21:4, 9; 25:12; 32:4; 43:3; 50:1; Ezekiel 1:3; Habakkuk 1:6) The cult of the Chaldeans was known for their practice of the occult arts in Babylon. Daniel was in exile in Babylon and interpreted a dream for the king when the "Chaldeans" (diviners) could not(Daniel 2:2, 5, 10; 4:7; 5:7, 11). It's government was destroyed when "Belshazzar the Chaldean king was killed." (Daniel 5:30)

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_were_the_Chaldean_people_in_the_Bible
« Last Edit: October 10, 2012, 10:20:50 AM by Molly »