Author Topic: Prophecy  (Read 150962 times)

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Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #550 on: September 25, 2012, 02:25:08 PM »
How it ends.
Just like reading a newspaper, says Wallid.

 :umnick:





The Antichrist will attack [by flatteries and deceit] the strongest country.


He will attack the mightiest fortresses with the help of a foreign god and will greatly honor those who acknowledge him. He will make them rulers over many people and will distribute the land at a price.  Dan 11:39






God will raise up seven shepherds and eight  principal men  to fight him and he will be expelled.


5 And this man shall be the peace, when the Assyrian shall come into our land: and when he shall tread in our palaces, then shall we raise against him seven shepherds, and eight principal men.

6 And they shall waste the land of Assyria with the sword, and the land of Nimrod in the entrances thereof: thus shall he deliver us from the Assyrian, when he cometh into our land, and when he treadeth within our borders.

--Micah 5





God  rises up the mightiest nations of the world [USA + allies] to fight the Antichrist and he is defeated and thrown into the pit.



7 Behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.

8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.  Eze 28



« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 02:36:19 PM by Molly »

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #551 on: September 25, 2012, 03:18:48 PM »
The ships of Chittim ["the West"] are already in the Persian Gulf


30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him:  Dan 11:39


 :umnick:




Iran test-fires anti-warship missiles near the Strait of Hormuz

While U.S.-led joint naval exercises continue in the Persian Gulf, Iran unveils missile capable of sinking targets as large as warships in 50 seconds, according to Iranian general.
By The Associated Press | Sep.25, 2012 | 11:54 AM | 2


http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/iran-test-fires-anti-warship-missiles-near-the-strait-of-hormuz-1.466804

Offline dajomaco

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #552 on: September 25, 2012, 07:28:12 PM »
The Gospel the TRUE Gospel must be preached.
Through out all the lands East and west and then the ends come.

Molly how many Muslims do you know whom have
 had a gospel of inclusion preached to them.
How many people have had the option to choose Jesus with out the threat
of being eternally tormented if they don't?

So many American Christians have their head up their

Apocalyptic Short Sightedness

That they are willing to let the rest of the world
go through a man made hell of war nuclear fire storms.

Molly time is of the essence you have been given a gift.
Please help us, who want to share the GOD news.


Offline WhiteWings

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #553 on: September 25, 2012, 07:35:38 PM »
Molly how many Muslims do you know whom have
 had a gospel of inclusion preached to them.
Slightly less than "Christians".
(most only know the Gospel of exclusion)
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #554 on: September 25, 2012, 08:42:46 PM »
Quote from: Dajo
The Gospel the TRUE Gospel must be preached.
Through out all the lands East and west and then the ends come.

Molly how many Muslims do you know whom have
 had a gospel of inclusion preached to them.
How many people have had the option to choose Jesus with out the threat
of being eternally tormented if they don't?

Dajo, every muslim country was originally a Christian country.  There is a remnant of Christians in each of these countries who somehow survived getting their heads cut off, their tongues cut out, their children murdered, their daughters taken into slavery--Does this sound harsh to you?    I have more than a passing acquaintance with the methods of this 'religion/government/political movement/system of law'.  Even so, this Christian remnant would happily risk their lives to give the gospel to any muslim that asked, even though they would probably risk jail or their lives by doing so.

The gospel has been preached in every muslim country.  Mostly, they don't want to hear it.  Do not ask me why.  You see, they do not have a Savior in their religion.   So torment is not a particular concern that they feel they can do much about.  Oh wait, I think they get good points for killing Christians and Jews and praying five times a day.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 08:58:29 PM by Molly »

Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #555 on: September 25, 2012, 09:52:49 PM »
If by 'gospel of inclusion' we mean "you're loved, Jesus loves you, He will save you, call on Him", then I'm on board.  If it's the 'gospel of inclusion' of "I'm OK, you're OK, doesn't matter if you're Muslim or ____", then I hope no one is preaching a gospel of inclusion to them.  I hope instead it would be a gospel of repentance and belief on Jesus for true righteousness - His.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2012, 10:01:10 PM by jabcat »
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #556 on: September 25, 2012, 09:59:26 PM »
Did he really just say that?

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam"






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6uZFSj_ueM

Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #557 on: September 25, 2012, 10:05:55 PM »
The man is a pitiful shame and an embarrassment.   IMO, a great spiritual blindness has occurred.

I don't think there's anyone available right now that's a "perfect' answer.  But I'd take Mickey Mouse.
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #558 on: September 25, 2012, 10:07:38 PM »
The gospel has been preached in every muslim country.  Mostly, they don't want to hear it.  Do not ask me why.

Something to do with demonic activity, the works of darkness, and God's timing.   :2c:
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #559 on: September 25, 2012, 10:37:54 PM »

So many American Christians have their head up their

Apocalyptic Short Sightedness

That they are willing to let the rest of the world
go through a man made hell of war nuclear fire storms.

Molly time is of the essence you have been given a gift.
Please help us, who want to share the GOD news.

daj, I appreciate a lot of what you have to say.  IMO, the red letters above and the insinuation of them border on the edge of inappropriateness.

Also, I don't know how many times you've been to the states, or how many thousands of Americans you've personally known, but I see several things from non-Americans.  Before I go there, I'll admit we have many problems, there is much blindness, apathy, self-centerdness in our society, and IMO, it's getting worse.  However, I believe at least SOME non-Americans assume that everyone in real life is walking around breathing fire and screaming about hell.  That's just not true.  Do most American Christians believe in it?  I'd say certainly.  They believe in it because that's what they've been taught and because they think the Bible truly teaches it - and they want to be faithful to the scriptures and to God by being obedient.  In my 54 years (next month) of being an American, I've come to see many things wrong with this country, for sure - although most of it is on a governmental level.  The people?  I've known thousands, tens of thousands.  Been in services since I was a year old.  I did grow up in an extraordinarily "backwoods" situation - small towns/villages, country people, much ignorance, on an educational and spiritual/Biblical level.  There was more talk and preaching of hell and fear there, for sure.  Still, it was mostly based on fear and attempts made to "talk people out of going there", with SOME threatening.  Later on in my teen and adult life - 35-40 years, I still knew thousands of people who believed in hell, but By FAR that was not their focus.  Neither was their focus threatening people with torture or retribution.  They preached the love of God, salvation, His ability to keep those who believe in Him safe and secure.  Was there enough of the "hell" stuff there to bother me?  Sure.  God took me out of it.  But still, by FAR the majority of these folks were loving, caring people, just doing the best they could with what they had.  They loved the Lord, served Him as they knew how, helped the sick, visited the shut-ins.  They were already living in the Kingdom through their faith in Jesus Christ as their Savior, His blood and mercy applied to their lives - not through a revelation of deeper doctrine such as UR or any other ancillary doctrine.  Most of those thousands of people I interacted were of 2 main denominations, so maybe I "chose" groups that weren't all hell-fire and brimstone.  I know those folks exist.  Unfortunately, many of them are on the internet, which I believe, can give a skewed appearance that "everyone's like that". 

As far as letting the rest of the world burn in a nuclear firestorm - from what I see of the American people, there's a real sense of "what in the world can I do about this - it looks destined to happen".  I think many, such as Molly for instance, don't want it to happen.  I believe Molly prays for God's Kingdom to come, for the time when God's righteousness covers the earth.  But IMO, there's a realistic side too.  I believe many in the Arab world have come from a lineage of spiritual blindness and rebellion, that dates back thousands of years.  The works of darkness are present and deeply ingrained.  Although I believe it's true we certainly should share the love of Jesus with them any way we can, I believe a reality is, for the most part, they will not hear, they will reject, and in fact, I believe the satan in them hates the gospel.  And only God Himself, in his perfect timing, as HE works out the events on the world stage, will one day turn their hearts to Him in repentance and belief.  It will be a miracle on a large scale, leading up to and including when God becomes All in All, when EVERY knee bows and every tongue confesses.  IMO, bringing the Muslim countries (and many others) to a saving faith in Jesus the Messiah will be a miraculous move of the Holy Spirit, with God making Himself directly known in a miraculous way. 

Though I KNOW there are exceptions, there are crazy people, evil people, mean people shouting slanders and falsehoods, what I see someone like Molly doing is just trying to discern and warn.  Although I personally have little idea about how prophecy fits together, when what happened and will happen, and I personally believe in being careful about forecasting etc., because I - I, just don't know, I believe there is a place for a "watchmen at the wall", sounding the call to be aware, eyes open, heads up, redemption draws nigh.  I personally am cautious about someone proclaiming things/predictions as absolute certainties.  But someone raising awareness, asking questions, exploring, IMO, is not having one's head, uh, in the sand. 

These of course are my opinions, and I've been wrong many time and will likely be again.  So a whole row of  :2c: can go here.

Blessings, James.

« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 12:10:57 AM by jabcat »
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

goodreport

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #560 on: September 25, 2012, 11:50:14 PM »
Jabcat, as I was reading your very long post, my mind and heart immediately went to Prov 15:4  A wholesome tongue is a tree of life....   v. 30  The light of the eyes rejoiceth the heart; and  good news nourishes/strengthens the bones."  And, of course, thought about the good report given by Joshua and Caleb ....  Blessings


Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #561 on: September 26, 2012, 12:13:40 AM »
Jabcat, as I was reading your very long post, my mind and heart immediately went to Prov 15:4  A wholesome tongue is a tree of life....   v. 30  The light of the eyes rejoiceth the heart; and  good news nourishes/strengthens the bones."  And, of course, thought about the good report given by Joshua and Caleb ....  Blessings

"Very long" is right.   :flowerred:

Amen.  I believe it's true, we should share Good News anywhere He leads us to proclaim it and if He does, then He makes the way! Blessings.

Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline dajomaco

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #562 on: September 26, 2012, 12:19:36 AM »
Jabcat
Thank you for a respectful and thoughtful response.
Some questions come to mind because of it.

1# If a person Is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and is told that if he does not worship Jesus that  they
and their families children will be tortured for ever.

Would you say the Gospel had been preached to them?

2#If a person is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and that person says "no never will I worship or serve a God
 who would sent people to hell"

Has that person rejected the Gospel?
 
I agree that the Red letters border on the edge of inappropriateness.

I guess I was being Cheeky

Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #563 on: September 26, 2012, 12:38:53 AM »
Jabcat
Thank you for a respectful and thoughtful response.
Some questions come to mind because of it.

1# If a person Is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and is told that if he does not worship Jesus that  they
and their families children will be tortured for ever.

Would you say the Gospel had been preached to them?

2#If a person is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and that person says "no never will I worship or serve a God
 who would sent people to hell"

Has that person rejected the Gospel?
 
I agree that the Red letters border on the edge of inappropriateness.

I guess I was being Cheeky

 :handshake:

Well, I'll answer your pertinent questions, along with a question of my own that IMO, is also pertinent and intertwined in the issue.

Your questions may not have an easy, yes/no answer, in a broad actual context.  I've sat through literally thousands of what's called here, "Invitations [to come to the Lord]" or "Altar Calls".  They're at the end of a service, when the sermon's done, and the preacher encourages/exhorts people to believe on and confess Jesus as their Savior.  In my pre-teen years (in the "backwoods/country" churches), there was quite a bit of hell-fire scare tactics during those Invitations.  I PROBABLY (I can't judge) saw some folks "convert" [and maybe they did] in an at least partial response to those threats and fears.  In those churches, I often saw people do what's called here "backsliding", i.e., making a confession of faith, then shortly turning back into their old ways, believing they were no longer saved, not even attempting to "live for the Lord".  Then they'd do it all over again.  Were some of them not really spiritually reborn because they were just responding to fear of hell, trying to escape it?  I'm not the judge, but possibly, it might seem reasonable to assume that could be the case in some instances.  Only God knows their hearts.

Later, in the more mainstream churches, of those thousands of invitations, 90%+ of the time, hell was never mentioned.  It was a declaration of "God loves you, He sent His Son to die on the cross for your sins, please come forward and accept Him today/tonight".   A related thought;  of the folks I've known and know that believe in ET/"hell", I almost NEVER EVER hear it even mentioned.  I BELIEVE, the concept is so awful to them, and that it deep-down makes so little sense to them, that even though they've been taught it all their life, believe it, believe the Bible teahes it, they push it back as something they don't want to think about or talk about with other people.  Certainly in not all but in many circles, it's generally not used to "evangelize".  Again, there are glaring exceptions and pockets of people who "MAJOR" in hell, are hate-filled, "damn" people there, etc...but I honestly believe that's a loud minority that gets attention.  And the reason they get attention is, it's disturbing!

So take those folks above in the mainstream churches, who are given this;  "God loves you, He sent His Son to die on the cross for your sins, please come forward and accept Him today/tonight".  Even if somewhere back in the crevaces of their subconscious mind there's a "hell" belief lingering, then here's my pertinent question.  If someone feels the conviction of the Holy Spirit, bows their heart before God and asks Jesus to save them and forgive them of their sins, and confess Him as Lord of their life - can one truthfully and scripturally say "they're not saved/spiritually reborn"?  What do the scriptures say?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 12:42:15 AM by jabcat »
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline dajomaco

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #564 on: September 26, 2012, 01:07:48 AM »
1# If a person Is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and is told that if he does not worship Jesus that  they
and their families children will be tortured for ever.

Would you say the Gospel had been preached to them? NO

2#If a person is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and that person says "no never will I worship or serve a God
 who would sent people to hell"

Has that person rejected the Gospel? NO

If someone feels the conviction of the Holy Spirit, bows their heart before God and asks Jesus to save them and forgive them of their sins, and confess Him as Lord of their life - can one truthfully and scripturally say "they're not saved/spiritually reborn"?  What do the scriptures say?

There are no formulas that an outside observer could use to see
and thus determine that some one else is in a right relationship with God

We can however determine whether the Gospel is being preached or not.

I do not think the Gospel the Good News has been preached to the Four
corners. Which leads back to Mollies prediction the end is near?
I believe the true Gospel is yet to be preached to all nations.





« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 01:11:51 AM by dajomaco »

truthquest

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #565 on: September 26, 2012, 01:09:12 AM »
Quote from: Dajo
The Gospel the TRUE Gospel must be preached.
Through out all the lands East and west and then the ends come.

Molly how many Muslims do you know whom have
 had a gospel of inclusion preached to them.
How many people have had the option to choose Jesus with out the threat
of being eternally tormented if they don't?

Dajo, every muslim country was originally a Christian country.  There is a remnant of Christians in each of these countries who somehow survived getting their heads cut off, their tongues cut out, their children murdered, their daughters taken into slavery--Does this sound harsh to you?    I have more than a passing acquaintance with the methods of this 'religion/government/political movement/system of law'.  Even so, this Christian remnant would happily risk their lives to give the gospel to any muslim that asked, even though they would probably risk jail or their lives by doing so.

The gospel has been preached in every muslim country.  Mostly, they don't want to hear it.  Do not ask me why.  You see, they do not have a Savior in their religion.   So torment is not a particular concern that they feel they can do much about.  Oh wait, I think they get good points for killing Christians and Jews and praying five times a day.
The Christian community in the Middle East wants to promote peace and live in peace. It is essential to protect and preserve the Christian community there. I share the view of these Christians to promote peace and I believe they have a right to live in peace. Christians in the Middle East have become more and more a minority. There are reasons why this has happened.

This is just one example but the same thing is true with what has happened in other Middle East countries and for the same reasons.
Monday, October 18, 2004-Compass Direct
Excerpt: "Christians in Iraq are becoming more and more of a minority, and they are being sacrificed for the sake of the war against terrorism taking place on the battlefield of Iraq," he said. "We feel depressed, because we are considered like a 'playing card' that outside forces can manipulate for their own aims.
"We Iraqis of various religious and ethnic backgrounds are used to living together and enjoying good relationships, but now these relations are being exploited," ....Without a strong Christian presence in Iraq, or candidates in the upcoming elections who insist on a separation between religion and the state, the country could move precariously toward becoming a theocracy dominated by Islamic parties and clerics. Iraqi Christians said they do not want to leave their country, but without the needed recognition and support of their rights, staying there is becoming a more difficult proposition.
http://www.crosswalk.com/1289972/?ps=0

It has been decided that Christians in the Middle East are acceptable collateral damage. The rise of political Islam is a threat to not only Christians but also Muslims. Middle Eastern countries often identity Christianity with the West and this also is a reason and the views and beliefs of many Christians in the West has fanned the flames of Islamic fundalmentalism. This has made Middle East Christians even more a target with increased persecution and violence.
Middle East Christians say that the number one thing they would ask for from other Christians throughout the world is prayer but they also ask for help to promote peace and for recognition of their rights.

Offline jabcat

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #566 on: September 26, 2012, 01:24:28 AM »
1# If a person Is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and is told that if he does not worship Jesus that  they
and their families children will be tortured for ever.

Would you say the Gospel had been preached to them? NO

2#If a person is asked to believe and worship Jesus Christ.
and that person says "no never will I worship or serve a God
 who would sent people to hell"

Has that person rejected the Gospel? NO

If someone feels the conviction of the Holy Spirit, bows their heart before God and asks Jesus to save them and forgive them of their sins, and confess Him as Lord of their life - can one truthfully and scripturally say "they're not saved/spiritually reborn"?  What do the scriptures say?

There are no formulas that an outside observer could use to see
and thus determine that some one else is in a right relationship with God

We can however determine whether the Gospel is being preached or not.

I do not think the Gospel the Good News has been preached to the Four
corners. Which leads back to Mollies prediction the end is near?
I believe the true Gospel is yet to be preached to all nations.

I disgree with your answers.  I believe an intensive study of the relevant scriptures about what it means to be spiritually reborn indicate otherwise than what you've stated as "requirement" and "exclusions" to salvation.  I prefer not to go gather all that information and present it, because I've already done searching on it, but the scriptures in summary say "believe on Jesus as Savior, confess your sins, trust the sufficiency of His sacrifice and resurrection", i.e., "call on the name of the Lord and you will be saved".     OTOH, I don't believe there's any scriptural backing for "believe and understand UR and you will be saved".  I don't believe it's Biblical, and to me, a disturbing trend I've noticed in some UR circles.

To my understanding, when someone is spiritually reborn, they are responding to a specific, personal call of the Holy Spirit to them.  I believe the scriptures teach the minimum they need to know is Jesus is the Messiah/Savior.  And by calling on Him in belief, they are spiritually reborn (saved).  It's a change of heart, a miracle, not based on advanced theological knowledge or revelation of deeper truths (UR for instance).

One more note, and then if you continue to believe as you currently do about it,  I'll just agree to amicably disagree with you on this, and we can focus on Jesus, Savior.  But using the line of thinking of "if they believe in hell or hell is part of the equation, then they can't be saved", brings this harshly into the spotlight - UR often uses a "better to believe now than face the purifying of the Lake of Fire" component.  It's a very ingrained part of most of UR teaching.  In fact, what did Jesus teach?  Kolasin aionion - a cutting off, pruning, punishment/correction for a period of time - not pleasant, a warning, something to be avoided. 

Well, thanks for the discussion.  If you have follow-up, within a few post hopefully we can get back to the prophecy thread, and/or we can split this off into its own thread.  Blessings.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 01:27:29 AM by jabcat »
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline dajomaco

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #567 on: September 26, 2012, 01:47:55 AM »
Quote from: Dajo
The Gospel the TRUE Gospel must be preached.
Through out all the lands East and west and then the ends come.

Molly how many Muslims do you know whom have
 had a gospel of inclusion preached to them.
How many people have had the option to choose Jesus with out the threat
of being eternally tormented if they don't?

Dajo, every muslim country was originally a Christian country.  There is a remnant of Christians in each of these countries who somehow survived getting their heads cut off, their tongues cut out, their children murdered, their daughters taken into slavery--Does this sound harsh to you?    I have more than a passing acquaintance with the methods of this 'religion/government/political movement/system of law'.  Even so, this Christian remnant would happily risk their lives to give the gospel to any muslim that asked, even though they would probably risk jail or their lives by doing so.

The gospel has been preached in every muslim country.  Mostly, they don't want to hear it.  Do not ask me why.  You see, they do not have a Savior in their religion.   So torment is not a particular concern that they feel they can do much about.  Oh wait, I think they get good points for killing Christians and Jews and praying five times a day.
The Christian community in the Middle East wants to promote peace and live in peace. It is essential to protect and preserve the Christian community there. I share the view of these Christians to promote peace and I believe they have a right to live in peace. Christians in the Middle East have become more and more a minority. There are reasons why this has happened.

This is just one example but the same thing is true with what has happened in other Middle East countries and for the same reasons.
Monday, October 18, 2004-Compass Direct
Excerpt: "Christians in Iraq are becoming more and more of a minority, and they are being sacrificed for the sake of the war against terrorism taking place on the battlefield of Iraq," he said. "We feel depressed, because we are considered like a 'playing card' that outside forces can manipulate for their own aims.
"We Iraqis of various religious and ethnic backgrounds are used to living together and enjoying good relationships, but now these relations are being exploited," ....Without a strong Christian presence in Iraq, or candidates in the upcoming elections who insist on a separation between religion and the state, the country could move precariously toward becoming a theocracy dominated by Islamic parties and clerics. Iraqi Christians said they do not want to leave their country, but without the needed recognition and support of their rights, staying there is becoming a more difficult proposition.
http://www.crosswalk.com/1289972/?ps=0

It has been decided that Christians in the Middle East are acceptable collateral damage. The rise of political Islam is a threat to not only Christians but also Muslims. Middle Eastern countries often identity Christianity with the West and this also is a reason and the views and beliefs of many Christians in the West has fanned the flames of Islamic fundalmentalism. This has made Middle East Christians even more a target with increased persecution and violence.
Middle East Christians say that the number one thing they would ask for from other Christians throughout the world is prayer but they also ask for help to promote peace and for recognition of their rights.
Sometimes people think that if someone has this label or that label
they must believe a certain way.
Lets say a Muslim and a Christian were working side by side.
They asked honest questions and they
gave honest answers.

Christian;
Do all Muslim believe that their God would will,
 that any one who does not bow down to Allah.
That it is  the duty of Muslim adherents, to behead that person.
 
Muslim answer;
Some Muslims do but not the Majority.

Muslim:
Do all Christians believe that their God would will
that any one you does not bow down to Jesus
That God will torture and torment that person for ever and keep alive this
person for ever so he can keep on tormenting him.

Christian answer,
Some do but only the Majority.   

The doctrine of Hell is the biggest source of unrest and peace in the Middle east.

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #568 on: September 26, 2012, 04:25:56 AM »
There is no moderate Islam



"I compare Islam to a ladder, and the first rung of that ladder starts with that traditional muslim, and the highest rung of that ladder is Jihad.  This is the highest and the most holy duty you can do for the God of the Koran.  The God of the Koran hates Jews...
This is what every muslim believes..if you die for the glory of the God of the Koran [as a suicide bomber] you go to heaven.  This is a big mistake: comparing between moderate muslims and the fanatics.  This is not how we compare it.  All muslims to me are the same.  At the end of the day, they believe in the God of the Koran, and they believe that this Koran is from that God.  [Moderate Islam] doesn't exist." 

He goes on to say that individual muslims might have a higher morality than their God--if that makes sense to anyone.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnmNBbOuOsY

truthquest

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #569 on: September 26, 2012, 04:33:40 AM »
There is no moderate Islam



"I compare Islam to a ladder, and the first rung of that ladder starts with that traditional muslim, and the highest rung of that ladder is Jihad.  This is the highest and the most holy duty you can do for the God of the Koran.  The God of the Koran hates Jews...
This is what every muslim believes..if you die for the glory of the God of the Koran [as a suicide bomber] you go to heaven.  This is a big mistake: comparing between moderate muslims and the fanatics.  This is not how we compare it.  All muslims to me are the same.  At the end of the day, they believe in the God of the Koran, and they believe that this Koran is from that God.  [Moderate Islam] doesn't exist." 

He goes on to say that individual muslims might have a higher morality than their God--if that makes sense to anyone.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnmNBbOuOsY
Well I will have to disagree with him. I don't believe that all Muslims hate and are the same. Christians in the Middle East would disagree with him and they should know.  :2c:

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #570 on: September 26, 2012, 04:59:01 AM »
There is no moderate Islam



"I compare Islam to a ladder, and the first rung of that ladder starts with that traditional muslim, and the highest rung of that ladder is Jihad.  This is the highest and the most holy duty you can do for the God of the Koran.  The God of the Koran hates Jews...
This is what every muslim believes..if you die for the glory of the God of the Koran [as a suicide bomber] you go to heaven.  This is a big mistake: comparing between moderate muslims and the fanatics.  This is not how we compare it.  All muslims to me are the same.  At the end of the day, they believe in the God of the Koran, and they believe that this Koran is from that God.  [Moderate Islam] doesn't exist." 

He goes on to say that individual muslims might have a higher morality than their God--if that makes sense to anyone.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnmNBbOuOsY
Well I will have to disagree with him. I don't believe that all Muslims hate and are the same. Christians in the Middle East would disagree with him and they should know.  :2c:

Sorry, you are very wrong about that.  The Armenians lived with the muslims 'peacefully,' in Turkey and then every once in a while the muslims would go on Jihad and kill a few and then things would settle down again, until one day they rounded up all 2 million of them and carried out a full blown genocide--99 percent gone.  That genocide was always built into the equation, it was not a matter of 'if' but 'when.'

What do you expect the Christians living there to say?  That is their home.  They have to do their best to get along.  You have no idea what is happening to Christians over there.

Have you noticed that once Christian countries have hardly any Christians left?  Do you think that is an accident?  The entire middle east was Christian when Islam was invented.  It was called the Byzantine empire.

I will say one thing for the Christians there, they are real Christians.  You would have to really be a believer to put up what they put up with for their faith.

Offline reFORMer

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #571 on: September 26, 2012, 08:37:01 AM »

Molly don't embarrass your self by saying these things
will happen during your life time.

They happened from 3 1/2 years prior and on up to 70 AD.  This is not a product of someone's imagination or wishful thinking.  Just what is happening in the Near East evaluated by very confused minds is part of the whole problem.  Religious indoctrination is often far from the truth.  What actually happen in history is the truth and Jesus called Himself The Truth.

The 7 signs of Matthew 24 that Jesus said not all the generation hearing Him would pass 'til all were fulfilled (which culminated 38 years later,) to say they will all 7 happen again is simply not truth.


As Scripture says, "Anyone who believes in him will never be put to shame."[e] 12
For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, 13 for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."[f]

Believe The Truth.
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #572 on: September 26, 2012, 08:44:19 AM »
The Harlot of Babylon, Rev 17 and 18 by Walid Shoebat



http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=1NkprOrLgeA



Who is The Harlot?


Mat 24 has to fit together with all the other prophecy in Revelation, in Isaiah, in Joel, in Ezekiel, in Daniel,  and so forth.  It all has to fit together.  And, the book is sealed until the end times.  What Walid Shoebat is describing in this video did not even happen until the mid 20th Century, right around the time the new country of Israel was established.

None of this can be understood unless you are exposed to all of the prophecy passages, which no one ever takes the time to do.  How can you know the truth if you don't know the Bible?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 10:03:05 AM by Molly »

Offline Molly

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #573 on: September 26, 2012, 09:04:24 AM »
Quote from: Reformer
The 7 signs of Matthew 24 that Jesus said not all the generation hearing Him would pass 'til all were fulfilled (which culminated 38 years later,) to say they will all 7 happen again is simply not truth.


Where does Jesus say not all the generation HEARING him would pass till all were fulfilled? 

That is not what he says.

This is what he says:

32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

--Mat 24



It is the generation that "sees all these things" who shall not pass until they all have been fulfilled.

 It's about SEEING, not hearing.



So scroll back, and tell me which of those things were not fulfilled in 70ad.

Offline reFORMer

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Re: Prophecy
« Reply #574 on: September 26, 2012, 09:08:04 AM »

Lebanon, Syria, Sinai, Jordan, Egypt, and Gaza---when do we declare Jerusalem emcompassed by armies?


"When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.  Luke 21:20

Who can't see Jerusalem surrounded with armies culminating in its destruction in 70 AD?  What does historical fact mean?  I find it difficult to reconcile what studying the subject of fulfilled prophecy reveals about Mt 24 and the people I assume are followers of the Lord who seem unable to recognize facts, or not be deterred by them.  Don't roll out the "double fulfillment" slight of hand.  Jesus indicated otherwise in what he said there with no hint of it all happening again.

Possibly the lack of a good presentation of an alternative view is part of why people don't want to leave the human tradition they've been taught.  Time for change may play a role.  It took me many years of hit and miss, here a little, there a little.  Way back when, I didn't see the importance and didn't know where to search for corrective teaching on eschatology.  Until we examine at least basic evidence, and it doesn't take that much reading (a little rebuttal, some pamphlet size teachings,) we really aren't very much scholars. 

A few years ago, because I had the time, and both experienced revelation and had read a shelf of books on the topic of Universal Salvation, I decided to test just how good the knowledge I congratulated myself for having really was.  Let me confront those who can challenge me.  Let me see if I can answer them.  Can they neither gainsay or resist? that is, are they able to best my knowledge and study or resist the Spirit working with the words I share?  This is how I ended up in tentmaker.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2012, 09:13:47 AM by reFORMer »
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!