Author Topic: New World Order - What Does It Mean?  (Read 31467 times)

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Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #75 on: April 02, 2009, 08:04:20 PM »
What gold?


Oh seriously,  lol.   Humor is good medicine.
Do you know what a fiat currency is?


Common type of currency issued by official order, and whose value is based on the issuing authority's guarantee to pay the stated (face) amount on demand, and not on any intrinsic worth or extrinsic backing. All national currencies in circulation, issued and managed by the respective central banks, are fiat currencies.



Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #76 on: April 02, 2009, 08:25:52 PM »
What gold?


Oh seriously,  lol.   Humor is good medicine.
Do you know what a fiat currency is?


Common type of currency issued by official order, and whose value is based on the issuing authority's guarantee to pay the stated (face) amount on demand, and not on any intrinsic worth or extrinsic backing. All national currencies in circulation, issued and managed by the respective central banks, are fiat currencies.



And you make my point of your paranoia is that you believe that our government is not going to honor that currency which is the only point and time where it would have no value.   

So thats where this all goes, your so scared and you do nothing but promote that fear as if tomorrow our money will be worthless.

Perhaps anything is possible, so now that you point out these facts, what does that mean? 

That fear is a misunderstanding of the system really,  this system has been in place for a long long time and the critics who say that a system cannot survive like that has long been proven wrong.


So what really are you in fear of?  What exactly is going to happen now that you are right about our currency?   what? 


Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #77 on: April 02, 2009, 08:29:42 PM »
Quote
And you make my point of your paranoia is that you believe that our government is not going to honor that currency which is the only point and time where it would have no value.   

Honor it with what?  The grand canyon?  The shirt off your back?

Our government is trillions of dollars in debt!  You are paying your bills with debt.

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That fear is a misunderstanding of the system really,  this system has been in place for a long long time and the critics who say that a system cannot survive like that has long been proven wrong.

It's been in place in its current form (no extrinsic backing) since 1971.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2009, 08:31:21 PM by Molly »

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #78 on: April 02, 2009, 08:31:50 PM »
Quote
And you make my point of your paranoia is that you believe that our government is not going to honor that currency which is the only point and time where it would have no value.   

Honor it with what?  The grand canyon?  The shirt off your back?

Our government is trillions of dollars in debt!  You are paying your bills with debt.




So whats going to happen?   What?   Spell it out.   



Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #79 on: April 02, 2009, 08:36:37 PM »
Quote
And you make my point of your paranoia is that you believe that our government is not going to honor that currency which is the only point and time where it would have no value.   

Honor it with what?  The grand canyon?  The shirt off your back?

Our government is trillions of dollars in debt!  You are paying your bills with debt.




So whats going to happen?   What?   Spell it out.   



I doubt you would listen no matter what I say.

Study runaway inflation.  Study the Weimer Republic in Germany.  Study the recent history of Argentina.

Figure out what happens when a country's currency is destroyed.

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #80 on: April 02, 2009, 08:40:56 PM »
Quote
And you make my point of your paranoia is that you believe that our government is not going to honor that currency which is the only point and time where it would have no value.   

Honor it with what?  The grand canyon?  The shirt off your back?

Our government is trillions of dollars in debt!  You are paying your bills with debt.




So whats going to happen?   What?   Spell it out.   



I doubt you would listen no matter what I say.

Study runaway inflation.  Study the Weimer Republic in Germany.  Study the recent history of Argentina.

Figure out what happens when a country's currency is destroyed.



Ok, when our country collaspes I'll admit your right,  maybe i'll tell you in person if we are sent to the same containment camp.

 Till then,  I will go to work and do the best I can, vote with the best of my ability and enjoy life and help those I can and not fear that which I have no control over.  I will encourage others to do the same.


Molly can you explain the ratio between our gross national product and the national debt and what that means? 




Offline Cardinal

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #81 on: April 02, 2009, 08:47:45 PM »
 :cloud9: Maybe it'll be one of these...... :sigh:

http://www.mindfull y.org/Reform/ 2004/FEMA- Concentration- Camps3sep04. htM

There over 800 prison camps in the United States, all fully operational and ready to receive prisoners. They are all staffed and even surrounded by full-time guards, but they are all empty. These camps are to be operated by FEMA (Federal Emergency Management Agency) should Martial Law need to be implemented in the United States and all it would take is a presidential signature on a proclamation and the attorney general's signature on a warrant to which a list of names is attached.
 
The camps all have railroad facilities as well as roads leading to and from the detention facilities. Many also have an airport nearby. The majority of the camps can house a population of 20,000 prisoners. Currently, the largest of these facilities is just outside of Fairbanks, Alaska. The Alaskan facility is a massive mental health facility and can hold approximately 2 million people.
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #82 on: April 02, 2009, 08:50:00 PM »
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Ok, when our country collaspes I'll admit your right,  maybe i'll tell you in person if we are sent to the same containment camp.

Oh, that will be cold comfort.

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Till then,  I will go to work and do the best I can, vote with the best of my ability and enjoy life and help those I can and not fear that which I have no control over.  I will encourage others to do the same.

Why are the only two options ignorance or fear?  Couldn't we educate ourselves so we know what is going on and have some input into our destinies and those of our children?

We may be sheep but we are Christ's sheep, not satan's.

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #83 on: April 02, 2009, 08:52:46 PM »
:cloud9: Maybe it'll be one of these...... :sigh:

http://www.mindfull y.org/Reform/ 2004/FEMA- Concentration- Camps3sep04. htM

There over 800 prison camps in the United States, all fully operational and ready to receive prisoners. They are all staffed and even surrounded by full-time guards, but they are all empty. These camps are to be operated by FEMA (Federal Emergency Management Agency) should Martial Law need to be implemented in the United States and all it would take is a presidential signature on a proclamation and the attorney general's signature on a warrant to which a list of names is attached.
 
The camps all have railroad facilities as well as roads leading to and from the detention facilities. Many also have an airport nearby. The majority of the camps can house a population of 20,000 prisoners. Currently, the largest of these facilities is just outside of Fairbanks, Alaska. The Alaskan facility is a massive mental health facility and can hold approximately 2 million people.


Hey, if I got sent to one of those, the bill collectors couldn't find me.   I'm going to go and create massive debt  far more than I can ever pay and enjoy the high life, I mean,  these paranoid people are sure that we are going to end up there and I now believe them, yeah,   so lets party.    Good luck getting my illusionary money out of this turnip.

Offline Cardinal

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #84 on: April 02, 2009, 08:55:57 PM »
 :cloud9: Here's another cheery article. This one was in the Seattle paper......

Use of military in quelling domestic unrest a scary sign

AMY GOODMAN
SYNDICATED COLUMNIST

A little-noticed story surfaced a couple of weeks ago in the Army Times newspaper about the 3rd Infantry Division's 1st Brigade Combat Team. "Beginning Oct. 1 for 12 months," reported Army Times staff writer Gina Cavallaro, "the 1st BCT will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command, as an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist attacks." Disturbingly, she writes that "they may be called upon to help with civil unrest and crowd control" as well.

The force will be called the chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear or high-yield explosive Consequence Management Response Force. Its acronym, CCMRF, is pronounced "sea-smurf." These "sea-smurfs," Cavallaro reports, have "spent 35 of the last 60 months in Iraq patrolling in full battle rattle," in a combat zone, and now will spend their 20-month "dwell time" -- time troops are required to spend to "reset and regenerate after a deployment" -- armed and ready to hit the U.S. streets.

The Army Times piece includes a correction stating that the forces would not use nonlethal weaponry domestically. I called Air Force Lt. Col. Jamie Goodpaster, a public affairs officer for Northern Command. She told me that the overall mission was humanitarian, to save lives and help communities recover from catastrophic events. Nevertheless, the military forces would have weapons on-site, "containerized," she said -- that is, stored in containers -- including both lethal and so-called nonlethal weapons. They would have mostly wheeled vehicles, but would also, she said, have access to tanks. She said that use of weapons would be made at a higher level, perhaps at the secretary of defense level.

Talk of trouble on U.S. streets is omnipresent now, with the juxtaposition of Wall Street and Main Street. The financial crisis we face remains obscure to most people; titans of business and government officials assure us that the financial system is "on the brink," that a massive bailout is necessary, immediately, to prevent a disaster. Conservative and progressive members of Congress, at the insistence of constituents, blocked the initial plan. If the economy does collapse, if people can't go down to the bank to withdraw their savings, or get cash from an ATM, there may be serious "civil unrest," and the "sea-smurfs" may be called upon sooner than we imagine to assist with "crowd control."

The political and financial establishments seem completely galled that people would actually oppose their massive bailout, which rewards financiers for gambling. Normal people worry about paying their bills, buying groceries and gas, and paying rent or a mortgage in increasingly uncertain times. No one ever offers to bail them out. Wall Street's house of cards has collapsed, and the rich bankers are getting little sympathy from working people.

That's where the sea-smurfs come in. Officially formed to respond to major disasters, like a nuclear or biological attack, this combat brigade falls under the U.S. Northern Command, a military structure formed on Oct, 1, 2002, to "provide command and control of Department of Defense homeland defense efforts." Military participation in domestic operations was originally outlawed with the Posse Comitatus Act in 1878. The John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007, however, included a section that allowed the president to deploy the armed forces to "restore public order" or to suppress "any insurrection." While a later bill repealed this, President Bush attached a signing statement that he did not feel bound by the repeal.

We are in a time of increasing economic disparity, with the largest gap between rich and poor of any wealthy industrialized country. We are witnessing a crackdown on dissent, most recently with $100 million spent on "security" at the Democratic and Republican national conventions. The massive paramilitary police forces deployed at the RNC in St. Paul, Minn., were complete overkill, discouraging protests and conducting mass arrests (National Guard troops just back from Fallujah were there). The arrest there of almost 50 journalists (myself included) showed a clear escalation in attempting to control the message (akin to the ban on photos of flag-draped coffins of dead soldiers). There are two ongoing, unpopular wars that are costing lives and hundreds of billions of dollars. Nobel- winning economist Joe Stiglitz estimates that Iraq alone will cost more than $3 trillion.

In December 2001, in the midst of restricted access to bank accounts due to a financial crisis, respectable, middle-class Argentinians rose up, took to the streets, smashed bank windows and ultimately forced the government out of power, despite a massive police crackdown and a failed attempt to control the media. Here in the U.S., with the prospect of a complete failure of our financial system, the people have spoken and do not want an unprecedented act of corporate welfare. We don't know how close the system is to collapse, nor do we know how close the people are to taking to the streets. The creation of an active-duty military force, the sea-smurfs, that could be used to suppress public protest here at home is a very bad sign.

Amy Goodman is the host of "Democracy Now!," a daily international TV/radio news hour. Denis Moynihan contributed to this column.
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #85 on: April 02, 2009, 09:03:15 PM »

Why are the only two options ignorance or fear?  Couldn't we educate ourselves so we know what is going on and have some input into our destinies and those of our children?



There are not only two options,  the problem is that someone only posts about it in the setting of paranoia.  You have to paint this picture that because I do not see such a gloomy horizon that I am ignorant and frankly I am fed up with people like you really.

Because I see a different picture of past wars i am a nuke lover and do not care about anyone.  Because I see the relationship of hard working americans and tax revenues concerning fiat money I get painted this picture that I am ignorant of the current problems.

The current problems are being addressed, it is not as if no one is trying to restructure anything, but no one who screams about all the ills of government and this issue want to try to listen and see that the housing crisis could of been avoided almost entirely had it simply kept the interest rates of those loans from going up causing most of the people who defaulted from being able to afford the note that they COULD afford when they first got the house.

So what happened was a mismanagment of interest rates and loose policies of lending sure indeed influenced it.


I am all for talking and learning,  but not when all this is shrouded in the nut jobs from the religious perspective of the gloom and doom of end times,  they are psychotic and spread this fear as if tomorrow the rapture will hit and  they get flashbacks of watching the "Left behind" series as if there is any truth to it.  what nonsense the "end times" has caused people.   If thats all you can relate this too, then you really have nothing to tell or educate anyone with.  period.

So yeah Molly lets actually get educated instead of talking about this NWO garbage as if our next meal is going to be behind the bars of a concentration camp after the evil congress exposes their hidden fangs.

Want me to listen,  theres how ya do it.


Offline jabcat

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #86 on: April 02, 2009, 09:13:32 PM »

so, I'm reluctant to ask this, but what happens when America defaults and China starts calling for a payback?
in the case of a home loan from a bank....what happens when one cannot pay back your bond?


Not the same scenario in the first place.   

China won't call for payback as what rational people actually see, even those in a communist nation,  is that it will never be in their best interest to try to hold the US over a barrel.



be careful who you call a "communist nation"...simple equation: communism=the state owns everything...America is fast approaching that...or have you not noticed how many of your civil liberties have been taken away in the last few years and how many banks and companies have been "bailed out"...and still it is continuing under the new administration

I'm pretty sure China will call in America's debt when the time is right...

interesting that in J. Preston's paper, he stated he saw a "flood of yellow" or something like that, sweeping across the nation  :dontknow:
« Last Edit: April 02, 2009, 10:26:37 PM by jabcat »
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martincisneros

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #87 on: April 02, 2009, 09:18:18 PM »
This isn't debt that's accrued since the founding era.  And it isn't debt that's accrued since WWII.  This is Bush Administration debt.  We weave in and out of being a creditor/debtor nation.  We were a creditor nation even within the last 30 years.  Might not have lasted, but check the books on it.  It happened.  Probably in another 10 years we'll be a creditor nation again.  We have these cycles.  All nations do.  In 50 years, China will probably owe us quite a bit.  It happens.  It's how nations have operated since the overthrow of Napolean Bonaparte.  Every era previously has had a revolution over it.  There have been a few revolutions in modern times.  But Paul's got a point that the bigger countries are going to get through these kinds of things under all of the normal circumstances that we've had thus far, i.e. what's normal for us.

Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #88 on: April 02, 2009, 09:29:01 PM »
This isn't debt that's accrued since the founding era.  And it isn't debt that's accrued since WWII.  This is Bush Administration debt.  We weave in and out of being a creditor/debtor nation.  We were a creditor nation even within the last 30 years.  Might not have lasted, but check the books on it.  It happened.  Probably in another 10 years we'll be a creditor nation again.  We have these cycles.  All nations do.  In 50 years, China will probably owe us quite a bit.  It happens.  It's how nations have operated since the overthrow of Napolean Bonaparte.  Every era previously has had a revolution over it.  There have been a few revolutions in modern times.  But Paul's got a point that the bigger countries are going to get through these kinds of things under all of the normal circumstances that we've had thus far, i.e. what's normal for us.
And, how are we going to do that with our industrial base destroyed, as it has been in the last ten years?

All our jobs are being shipped overseas.  Farmers were destroyed decades ago.  Even electronics is leaving the ship.

What are we going to produce--consumers?

PS did you happen to look at our deficit for this year? It's trillions with an s.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2009, 09:34:03 PM by Molly »

Offline Cardinal

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #89 on: April 02, 2009, 09:45:25 PM »

What are we going to produce--consumers?

 :cloud9: I have been wondering about that. Not much left is there?
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

martincisneros

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #90 on: April 02, 2009, 09:45:59 PM »
The majority of the jobs lost to overseas are the low wage, no skill jobs that wouldn't help the economy if they came back 'cause they wouldn't produce a living wage if you had 3 of them at the same time.  Our deficits, whenever we have 'em, are always in the trillions 'cause we're hundreds of millions of people paying for billions of dollars worth of services each time the government decides to do something.  Farmers really aren't doing too bad, with the exception of weather issues giving them a hard time in recent years. 

I genuinely believe that God's favor is still on the United States and that we'll have other sources of income, other new inventions, other forms of industry and technology that we'll be leaders in, etc.  There are too many signs of God's favor still on this country.  You're just choking on dollar figures and legislation passed in times of war, which isn't a lot different from legislation that's been passed in previous times of global war.  When we're no longer fighting with Islamic terrorists, then the laws on the books right now that are inconveniencing so many lives will be repealed as in previous decades. 

Some things will be more secure than they had been, and that's for the good of all of us, really.  Islam's what's going to fall, Molly.  Not Christianity and not the Christian nations of the world.  When it says that the Kingdoms of this world become the Kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, it's not talking about exclusively third world nations as you seem to think that this country is on the fast track towards becoming.  Things will get better.  God remembers the Covenant that He has with the United States.  There is genuinely nothing to fear except for our own individual lack of good judgment at times when we ourselves create our own economic and health blunders.

Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #91 on: April 02, 2009, 09:50:43 PM »
Last I checked, the auto workers were getting the equivalent of 80 to 100K a year when you add in all the benefits, including health and pension.

I would hardly call that a low wage job.

These are not unskilled workers--they are among the last skilled workers our country has.

They can actually build things--as opposed to the bankers who are just a bunch of parasites.

martincisneros

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #92 on: April 02, 2009, 09:52:24 PM »
Those aren't the only jobs, Molly.

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #93 on: April 02, 2009, 09:55:54 PM »
And, how are we going to do that with our industrial base destroyed, as it has been in the last ten years?

Not all of it,  what happens is people become comfortable with the norm and as industry becomes  (obsolete)  new industry can be created.  At one time 8 track tapes made alot of people a lot of money, so do we see that industry is destroyed because there is no market for the 8 track tape?   No,  there was cassettes, then CD's,  laser discs, the DVD's,  now Blue ray.

What we need in this country are people who are encouraging about new things.   I would say, the doom sayers can be proven right, if people give up and see nothing but nothing.

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All our jobs are being shipped overseas. 

Again,  if you wish to educate and promote ideas in your little part of the world, then stop generalizing to paint the gloom.   All our jobs are not overseas.   Does this mean I am ignorant now?   No it means one reason I vote the way I did was to promote ideas that will keep as many jobs as possible over here.  What I would rather see, and few people EVER bring this up, I would rather see the INCOME of a nation that jobs go to go up to the point that an american company has no financial incentive to send jobs over there.

What I would rather see is is AMERICANS educated and less greedy so that unions and "I have to get whats mine" mentalities are squashed so that pay levels are not extraordinarily inflated that also influences a company to look overseas if it can.

The aircraft factories over here could employ double the people with no layoffs if people became more content and saw the greater factor of more people working rather than what they can get for themselves.   


It REALLY is obscene that another countries wages are so low that they can build a factory over there,  SHIP goods in to another country,  PAY the workers in that country, then SHIP the goods back to our country and STILL make more money than if the jobs base was here.

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Farmers were destroyed decades ago.

Farming is an interest of mine because I grew up on one, that does not make me a undeniable expert, but here is another statement that is geared to cause fear.   Farming is alive and well in america.   It is the small family farm that struggles, but that is not entirely all there is to it.

My Dad retired from farming and the last years he was active in it he did not make very much after expenses and such,  my dad was mainly a grain farmer, but it was sad that my dad did not owe one cent on the land or the property the house was on and had such financial struggles as far as the base income for that year.   It was the cost ratio of fertilizer and weed killer based on the acreage he had.   My Dad only had 80 acres.

Now, why did those cost get so high,  it is mainly because of the costs associated with a product so highly regulated that the cost of production is extremely high.  It stems from an issue that actually is lengthy to explain,  but it stems again from greed and dumb people and I say that quite bluntly, dumb people who get poisoned from farm chemicals who would have gotten poisoned no matter how safe something was manufactured.   All that adds to the cost.

If you have 1000 acres you can recoup the cost ratio.  You have 80 acres, that alone will put a huge strain on the productivity of a farm.

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  Even electronics is leaving the ship.

America has never been very competative since circuitry went micro,  its not really an issue to the currect problem.

Quote
What are we going to produce--consumers?

Invent something rather than complaining.



Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #94 on: April 02, 2009, 10:03:04 PM »
Last I checked, the auto workers were getting the equivalent of 80 to 100K a year when you add in all the benefits, including health and pension.

I would hardly call that a low wage job.

These are not unskilled workers--they are among the last skilled workers our country has.

They can actually build things--as opposed to the bankers who are just a bunch of parasites.



Actually your not very well informed, a monkey can put together half the stuff on an automobile assembly line.


Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #95 on: April 02, 2009, 10:14:54 PM »
So now a country that used to be the breadbasket of the world is importing tainted grain from China.

We are importing our food now--does this make any sense to anyone?

Having driven farmers out of business, it is now cheaper to ship a heavy weight product like grain thousands of miles over the seas than to grow it in our own country?

That makes sense?

Sounds like a national security issue to me.

I would rather eat something produced by my own countrymen who I know would not want to poison me.

Just like I would rather drill my own oil than pay a middle man and send billions of dollars to countries who may not have my best interests at heart.

All of these things are just common sense--along with the fact that you don't destroy your middle class unless you are enamored with tyranny and monkeys.

But common sense is not very common anymore...

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #96 on: April 02, 2009, 10:23:39 PM »

That makes sense?


Yes actually it does if you weigh all the factors that cause it. 

The point I am getting at is not that I  "LIKE" it because it makes sense, it is that it makes sense that helps create a solvable problem.

What do you think those factors are?

Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #97 on: April 02, 2009, 10:29:13 PM »
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What do you think those factors are?

The biggest factor, in my opinion, is that our country has been run by the very same globalists that are now calling for a new world order, at least since John Kennedy was murdered.  He was our last real president.

Globalists want a central bank for the entire world.  And, no nation states.  And, no freedom.

End of story.  Very simple.

Paul Hazelwood

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #98 on: April 02, 2009, 10:36:38 PM »
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What do you think those factors are?

The biggest factor, in my opinion, is that our country has been run by the very same globalists that are now calling for a new world order, at least since John Kennedy was murdered.  He was our last real president.

Globalists want a central bank for the entire world.  And, no nation states.  And, no freedom.

End of story.  Very simple.




And to think I was actually willing to listen to some dialog from you.   My bad. 



Offline Molly

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Re: New World Order - What Does It Mean?
« Reply #99 on: April 02, 2009, 10:42:48 PM »
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What do you think those factors are?

The biggest factor, in my opinion, is that our country has been run by the very same globalists that are now calling for a new world order, at least since John Kennedy was murdered.  He was our last real president.

Globalists want a central bank for the entire world.  And, no nation states.  And, no freedom.

End of story.  Very simple.




And to think I was actually willing to listen to some dialog from you.   My bad. 



Yes, in order to talk to me, you would have to actually know what a central bank is.