Author Topic: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?  (Read 213 times)

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Offline Caffus

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Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« on: May 17, 2015, 11:49:34 PM »
Again, I'm a firm believer in UR. God chose to reveal it to me and so, I know there is always an answer. I just want to understand all I can, not only for myself but so I have good answers if I'm ever asked.
Rev 22: 14-15
Happy are those doing His commands that the authority shall be thiers unto the tree of life, and by the gates they may enter into the city ;15and without are the dogs, and the sorcerers, and the whoremongers, and the murderers, and the idolaters, and every one who is loving and is doing a lie."
Now, I know we will all be changed and made new when eternity begins, but these verses are near the end of the Bible after hades and death are cast in the lake of fire and after the verse that says "Behold I make all things new"
Is the Bible just not in order or whats going on here?

Offline Seth

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2015, 12:49:18 AM »
I think he is talking about the new creature in Christ. The word "behold" means "look" as in look at this "bride" the tabernacle of God is with men. It is by that means that God will make all things new. For the sons of God will welcome all creation into their glorious liberty (Romans 8).

Offline Tom

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2015, 12:56:51 AM »
I think most folks assume Revelation is the end of the story just because somebody stuck it at the end of the Bible, but it's Paul who speaks of the consummation of the eons.

"through Him to reconcile all to Him (making peace through the blood of His cross), through Him, whether those on the earth or those in the heavens" (Colossians 1:20)

"Yet now Christ has been roused from among the dead, the Firstfruit of those who are reposing. For since, in fact, through a man came death, through a Man, also, comes the resurrection of the dead. For even as, in Adam, all are dying, thus also, in Christ, shall all be vivified. Yet each in his own class: the Firstfruit, Christ; thereupon those who are Christ's in His presence; thereafter the consummation, whenever He may be giving up the kingdom to His God and Father, whenever He should be nullifying all sovereignty and all authority and power. For He must be reigning until He should be placing all His enemies under His feet. The last enemy is being abolished: death. For He subjects all under His feet. Now whenever He may be saying that all is subject, it is evident that it is outside of Him Who subjects all to Him. Now, whenever all may be subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also shall be subjected to Him Who subjects all to Him, that God may be All in all." (1 Corinthians 15:20-28)

http://www.saviourofall.org/charts/ChartOfJudgments.html

Offline Caffus

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2015, 01:20:34 AM »
Yes, I know Revaluation. doesn't necessarily mean its the end of the story or that it really belongs at the end of the Bible. However Rev. 21:4-5 It talks about wiping all our tears away and then says Behold I make all things new...which, I thought was supposed to mean when He makes all humans rightouse in Him. But then it goes on to talk about evil doers in Rev 21:8 and how thier part is in the lake of fire ect.  And in Rev 22 the sinners outside the city..this is all in Rev.

Offline Tom

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2015, 01:35:51 AM »
Revelation is not chronological, kind of like the thing with flashbacks in movies. And the fact that the lake of fire is still there tells you the end hasn't happened yet because the lake of fire is called the second death, and death, the last enemy, hasn't been abolished yet.

http://concordant.org/expohtml/TheUnveiling/TheUnveiling.htm

Offline rosered

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2015, 01:39:50 AM »
 
 
 
 HI Caffus  it goes with Rev11  I believe 11 And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.

2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
 
  what was sealed   and in Rev  22  is no longer sealed  so you can understand it and  all these things begin to      happen
 
  you  know by the Holy Spirit  witness   , hope this helps
Jesus is the reward  !!

Offline rosered

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2015, 01:53:22 AM »
Revelation is not chronological, kind of like the thing with flashbacks in movies. And the fact that the lake of fire is still there tells you the end hasn't happened yet because the lake of fire is called the second death, and death, the last enemy, hasn't been abolished yet.

http://concordant.org/expohtml/TheUnveiling/TheUnveiling.htm

  Yes   Tom  ,   It is not in any order , but is more like a KEY to me that   the Lamb unlocks  [given a   right  for us , to understand the    whole bible     the old and new     
  This   to me is the book of Life and the book of the dead/memorial  that   testifies of Jesus Christ
 
  the sure  mercies of David  unlocks no man open   rev 3 and Isaiah 22 ;22 21And I will clothe him with your tunic And tie your sash securely about him. I will entrust him with your authority, And he will become a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and to the house of Judah. 22"Then I will set the key of the house of David on his shoulder, When he opens no one will shut, When he shuts no one will open. 23"I will drive him like a peg in a firm place, And he will become a throne of glory to his father's house.


 7"And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write: He who is holy, who is true, who has the key of David, who opens and no one will shut, and who shuts and no one opens, says this: 8'I know your deeds. Behold, I have put before you an open door which no one can shut, because you have a little power, and have kept My word, and have not denied My name. 9Behold, I will cause those of the synagogue of Satan, who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie-- I will make them come and bow down at your feet, and make them know that I have loved you.
 
 
   They all fit together   and witness the same thing  for more of the information  though out the Word  of God  . .
 
 
Jesus is the reward  !!

Offline Seth

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2015, 02:07:47 AM »
Yes, I know Revaluation. doesn't necessarily mean its the end of the story or that it really belongs at the end of the Bible. However Rev. 21:4-5 It talks about wiping all our tears away and then says Behold I make all things new...which, I thought was supposed to mean when He makes all humans rightouse in Him. But then it goes on to talk about evil doers in Rev 21:8 and how thier part is in the lake of fire ect.  And in Rev 22 the sinners outside the city..this is all in Rev.

I think the context shows that the all things he makes new are those who have inherited that city. If I pick some apples and put them in a basket, and say "behold all the apples," I'm not talking about all the apples on the planet.

Offline rosered

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2015, 02:30:12 AM »

 
 Yes Seth ,,, those who are given the right to enter   by the Lord  whom holds all the keys      :winkgrin:
 
   the keys of Hell  /hidden   unseen , and death and  gives  them to whomever He will and   the Key of David  as well   
 
  keys   to the  Kingdom   

since the keeper of the keys has the power to open  allow entry  and to shut or  keep out

metaph. in the NT to denote power and authority of various kinds
 
Spiritual   gifts to mankind


 Matthew 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven
Jesus is the reward  !!

Offline Tom

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2015, 02:59:41 AM »
I think the ecclesia, the body of Christ, will have already been vivified and snatched away to meet Christ in the air because we'll be saved from indignation. (1 Thessalonians 4:17; Romans 5:9) I think Revelation was written to the Jewish people about the coming judgments of God and the fulfillment of their promised kingdom of the heavens on earth where some will be, but some will be excluded. The dead who aren't written in the scroll of life will be condemned at the great white throne and cast into the lake of fire which is the second death. (Revelation 20:14) I think that will happen after the thousand years of the next eon, (Revelation 20:5) but we don't how long the eon of the eons after that will last until the consummation when all on the earth and in the heavens will be reconciled to God through Christ's blood on the cross and God will be all in all.

http://concordant.org/expohtml/TheUnveiling/TheUnveiling.htm

http://www.saviourofall.org/charts/ChartOfJudgments.html

Offline Caffus

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2015, 04:00:03 AM »
Ok, so Rev is not in order ok...I've heard that Behold I make all things new, means all...but I geuss it doesn't. All I know is all my tears wont be wiped away until were God is all in all. It hurts me to see evil, sin , people hurting, unbelieving ect.

Offline rosered

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2015, 05:03:08 AM »
Ok, so Rev is not in order ok...I've heard that Behold I make all things new, means all...but I geuss it doesn't. All I know is all my tears wont be wiped away until were God is all in all. It hurts me to see evil, sin , people hurting, unbelieving ect.

  Yes it does  hurt  ,
 
 But your tears are not for nothing they do count !!
  you are sealed because it Grieves the Holy Spirit as well  :sigh:
 
 
 
  Ezekiel 9 3Then the glory of the God of Israel went up from the cherub on which it had been, to the threshold of the temple.

 And He called to the man clothed in linen at whose loins was the writing case.

 4The LORD said to him, "Go through the midst of the city, even through the midst of Jerusalem, and put a mark on the foreheads of the men who sigh and groan over all the abominations which are being committed in its midst." 5But to the others He said in my hearing, "Go through the city after him and strike; do not let your eye have pity and do not spare.
 
 Jesus  weeps for Jerusalem
 Luke 19:41-44English Standard Version (ESV)

Jesus Weeps over Jerusalem
41 And when he drew near and saw the city, he wept over it, 42 saying, Would that you, even you, had known on this day the things that make for peace!

But now they are hidden from your eyes.

 43 For the days will come upon you, when your enemies will set up a barricade around you and surround you and hem you in on every side


44 and tear you down to the ground, you and your children within you. And they will not leave one stone upon another in you, because you did not know the time of your visitation.
Jesus is the reward  !!

Offline Caffus

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2015, 05:25:24 AM »
Yes, Rose
But even though, it hurts now. We have peace and joy in the hope that in His time He will make ALL things Beutiful!  :girlheart:

Offline rosered

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2015, 03:29:33 PM »
Yes, Rose
But even though, it hurts now. We have peace and joy in the hope that in His time He will make ALL things Beutiful!  :girlheart:

 
  Yes indeed  Caff ,  Our Hope is In   God  :HeartThrob:
Jesus is the reward  !!

Offline eaglesway

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #14 on: May 19, 2015, 09:06:55 AM »
The City is already real and "coming down from heaven" as the generations of the age pass, living stones are added to her upon the foundation of the apostles, Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone.

Outside the city are adulterers, sorcerers, homosexuals, fornicators, everyone who makes and loves a lie. They are outside because the only way in is the Door, anyone who attempts to enter any other way is a thief and a liar.

But this city is the heavenly Jerusalem, beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth(Psalm 48 Heb 12) on the sides of the north, the heights of MT ZION.

As Isaiah reports, "UPON THIS MOUNTAIN I WILL TAKE AWAY THE VEIL THAT COVERS ALL THE PEOPLE".

Weeping endures for the night, behold, joy comes in the morning. Blessed are those who go forth weeping, spreading seed, they will return rejoicing, their sheaves carried with them. Beautiful upon the mountaintops are the feet of them that spread good news of glad tidings for all.
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. www.hellisamyth.com

Offline Cardinal

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Re: Qeustion. on Rev 22:14-15 about those Outside the city?
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2015, 08:42:28 PM »
 :cloud9: :thumbsup: :banana:
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor