Author Topic: Twice the sons of Hell  (Read 3465 times)

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Offline Brian

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Twice the sons of Hell
« on: October 11, 2012, 04:41:00 PM »
`Wo to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye go round the sea and the dry land to make one proselyte, and whenever it may happen -- ye make him a son of gehenna twofold more than yourselves. - Matthew 23:15 (YLT)

I used the Young's Literal Translation for better perspective, than those using "hell" in place of "gehenna" (Valley of Hinnom)

Any thoughts as to exactly what Jesus is talking about from a UR perspective?
For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have fixed our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of believers. 1 Timothy 4:10

Offline shawn

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2012, 05:02:11 PM »
I think you need to go to the passage that I believe Jesus was referencing in Jeremiah 7:30-32. (NIV) yes NIV...gasp...lol.

The people of Judah have done evil in my eyes, declares the Lord. They have set up their detestable idols in the house that bears my Name and have defiled it. 31 They have built the high places of Topheth in the Valley of Ben Hinnom to burn their sons and daughters in the fire—something I did not command, nor did it enter my mind. 32 So beware, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when people will no longer call it Topheth or the Valley of Ben Hinnom, but the Valley of Slaughter, for they will bury the dead in Topheth until there is no more room.

Valley of Ben Hinnom=Gehenna.  What were the sons of Gehenna?  Sons sacrificed to idols.  God never commanded it, nor did it enter His mind.

So the Pharisees were worshipping their false god of religion, though false teachings keeping the people out of the Kingdom of God in the Hinnom Valley...in Gehenna (outside of the gates of the city)...and metaphorically sacrificing children all over again in this valley with false teachings and law.

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2012, 05:08:39 PM »
The biblical term "proselyte" is an anglicization of the Koine Greek term προσήλυτος/proselytos, as used in the Greek Old Testament for "stranger", i.e. a "newcomer to Israel";[1] a "sojourner in the land",[2] and in the Greek New Testament[3] for a first century convert to Judaism, generally from Ancient Greek religion. It is a translation of the Biblical Hebrew phrase גר תושב/ger toshav.[4]


I think it means it means the priests don't convert the pagans to Biblical based religion but just teach their own false interpretations of the law. Mixed with pagan stuff makes a some that has unbiblical pagan believes + unbiblical Jewish believes.

It's means the pagans were in a better state before thier conversion.

It means they make ETs  :winkgrin:


1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline scarletwren

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2013, 10:52:38 PM »
The biblical term "proselyte" is an anglicization of the Koine Greek term προσήλυτος/proselytos, as used in the Greek Old Testament for "stranger", i.e. a "newcomer to Israel";[1] a "sojourner in the land",[2] and in the Greek New Testament[3] for a first century convert to Judaism, generally from Ancient Greek religion. It is a translation of the Biblical Hebrew phrase גר תושב/ger toshav.[4]


I think it means it means the priests don't convert the pagans to Biblical based religion but just teach their own false interpretations of the law. Mixed with pagan stuff makes a some that has unbiblical pagan believes + unbiblical Jewish believes.

It's means the pagans were in a better state before thier conversion.

It means they make ETs  :winkgrin:

This makes sense to me.  Very similar to Shawn's thoughts.

Offline Colleen

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2013, 07:57:07 AM »
I just had to cry and cry when I read WW's response. "It means they make ET's." So many times in the last three years I have wished I had remained in the false religion I had been in for so long before I came to the "Christian church". After the beautiful birth in my spirit of the grace of God the dilemma of the ET doctrine soon came to the forefront of of my mind and took me to the darkest place I have ever been. The ensuing mental breakdown and depression still has a hold on me today and everyday even after coming to UR truth. The demons still whisper "surely it is not so". Even on UR sites, doctrines of judgement and wrath and the second death torment me daily. I don't understand the weapons of our warfare. And I cry out "will this ever stop?"  That peace which passeth all understanding is gone and it's memory is fading. That joy with which I danced around my house and yard blessing God- gone. That desire to shout from the rooftops replaced with I'll never tell a soul. If I can save one person from going through the hell I'm living through it would be worth it. Please Lord, especially not my children, who I'm supposed to hate. Sick of it all!

Offline eaglesway

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2013, 08:19:40 AM »
You are not supposed to hate your children!!??

God is Love!

If we are in God we will be walking in LOVE!

That is where the joy and peace comes from :o)

I lost my first born son a couple years ago, at the age of 30. He was not a believer! I praise God that long before he passed away, I knew that God's plan is the salvation of all :o) There is peace where there used to be fear. Hope where there used to be despair. Mercy where there used to be judgment. We hold the "good news" in our hearts and our hands!

There is no salvation in religion. No deliverance in "churchianity". It is only the grace of God and the shed blood of Jesus our savior and also the savior of the whole world -in God's time.

 In all wisdom and insight He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth. In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, to the end that we who were the first to hope in Christ would be to the praise of His glory.
(Eph 1:8-12)

God has let you in on His glorious secret!

For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, "Abba! Father!" The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him. For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us. For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God.
(Rom 8:14-21)

I pray that you will be set free from every lying whisper, and the grace of God will abound in your faith, and that your rejoicing in this glorious "good news" will help set this futile world free, in your little corner of the world.
Grace to you and peace, in Jesus' name.







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Offline Colleen

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2013, 04:32:50 PM »
 Sorry EW. I thought the reference would be clear: "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple.
New Living Translation (©2007)

Then you said:For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, "Abba! Father!"
Well it seems to me that I must not be following the Spirit or be a son of God because I have this spirit of slavery leading to fear. I have it everyday! Sometimes all day.
 
I am supposed to try the spirits. When I thought I was in the spirit, speaking in tongues, I read that tongues is another language not some unintelligible babbling; that this same "speaking" is seen in heathen tribes all over the world.

When I was going within, because I read that that is where the kingdom of God is, I was warned that I was engaging in contemplative prayer.

I am a body worker who has worked with energy for years. Then I read these things are from the eastern religions and should not be practiced and that I was engaging in witchcraft. And I thought I was following the spirit.

These are just some of the things I am dealing with. It is overwhelming to say the least.

I am so sorry you lost your son! Thank you for taking time to respond to my post.


Offline lomarah

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2013, 06:08:43 PM »
Ohhhh Colleen. :'(
I think many if not all of us can say we've been there. In very similar circumstances, dealing with the fear of all these things. I was in a very, very dark place when the Lord first led me to UR beliefs. It took a couple of years afterwards to come out of it. I was in such a dark place that the sunlight hurt me. Those who once "loved" me and called me sister and friend now treated me as if I were satan himself just because I didn't believe in the traditional view of hell. Have you ever been called the devil? It doesn't do nice things to you mentally if you aren't at a place where your faith is strong and you have a closeness with God. (Likely people telling you that you are practicing witchcraft is having a similar effect.) Like you I went from dancing in joy before the Lord to complete and utter torment. I know where you are sister and my heart is aching for you.

I want to instill hope in you now, because the Lord took me from that dark place of torment and has brought me to a place in Him where I am receiving more and more light and life than I ever thought possible. I have heard Him sing over me, speak assuring words to me, have been given dreams and visions, and felt His love in completely overwhelming and tangible ways. He sent me spiritual mothers and a father to guide me and pray for me. I have finally experienced the love and unity that the bible speaks of amidst my sisters and brothers. (It's rare but it is out there and it's growing!!) You are here for a reason.  :HeartThrob:

As for Jesus telling us to "hate" our families, He was giving us a dramatic illustration of what it means to follow Him: that we must be willing to obey His leading at all costs, no matter what our families have to say about it. This is how He has come to set family member against family member, not because He wants us at war with them but because it's the natural reaction when one member pursues Him (in truth) while the others don't. Jesus said many things that religious people take and run with, many things that can be taken the wrong way (to say the least lol). Why did He do that? I think one reason is to "shame the 'wise'" and make a mockery of them. Look how ridiculous religious people of today seem. (As did the pharisees.) This is not to say they are not precious in His sight, only that they need to be brought to the place where they see the ridiculousness of their prideful religiosity and are humbled in shame. (As He had to do to me and continues to do. Thankfully He also gives you the ability to have a good laugh at yourself lol.)

As for your job, I'm not exactly sure what you do but first we need to realize that all of us have "witchcraft" and every other type of evil seed in us. (All sin is common to man.) Whether we've brought it to "birth" or not, we've at least entertained thoughts of these things. And guess what? God meant it that way. We have these things in order for us to overcome these things (or rather for Him to overcome them in us.) Why did witches get stoned in the OT? To show us that in the spiritual witchcraft will not bring life but rather it will bring death. All of the things in the OT were types and shadows of spiritual things to come. So even if your job is "witchcraft" (I seriously don't know, I'm just playing the "what if" game), it doesn't mean that God despises you, only that it won't bring true life and healing to you or those you deal with, it will just bring death (spiritually, even as many are already spiritually dead). On the contrary, the Father loves you and sent His Son to bring you life, so if what you are doing is bringing death (as many things on this earth do), it doesn't mean He's angry and against you, it just means He is longing to bring you life rather than the death that is being manifested. (I feel like I'm rambling, I hope this makes sense...) Pray for guidance and follow the leading of God alone, forgetting what religious men have to say. (He had to send me "mothers" who could hear because it took me awhile before I was able to trust my own hearing again lol. He may do the same for you and I do believe He may have already. :) [I don't mean me lol.])

You are on my heart and in my prayers!! Much love to you Colleen.  :HeartThrob:
From Him and through Him and to Him are all things.

Offline lomarah

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2013, 06:38:35 PM »
Oh I forgot to mention, I realized after I came out of the dark years that Father had been speaking to me during those years as well, it's just that I wouldn't accept it. If He would speak loving words to me I rejected it because subconsciously I believed that He must consider me a heretic too (LOL it maks no sense but that's how I felt). It's possible this is happening to you as well?
From Him and through Him and to Him are all things.

Offline sheila

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2013, 08:31:35 PM »
Beautifully said,Lo.   Love is the perfect bond of union...it cast outall fear...Knowing His perfect

 love for us[keeps no record of the wrongs] teaches us what love really is. That He would

 lay down His life for our sakes..that we may live..and when He take it back up again......

 drag all men up with Him..into the heavens.

   offspring of viper spirits are very religious..ready to condemn for the slightest perceived

 infraction...they reject the grace of God given through Jesus...so they may continue to

sit in the seat of Moses...positions of power and prestige over others..maintained by fear

 and accusation.  They heap up heavy loads on men, impossible to bear...why they did the

same to Jesus Christ Himself..unable to carry His own cross without assist[cyrene conscripted]

     I remember the terror..from my days in Babylonish captivity. I pray you be set free..Colleen

   ...for I am convinced...that nothing can seperate us[you!] from the love of God that was shown

us through His son..... no trouble,hardship,persecution famine or nakedness danger or sword

   not death,nor life,neither ngels or demons neither present nor future nor any powers

  neither height nor depth nor ANYTHING ELSE IN ALL CREATION,WILL BE ABLE TO SEPERATE

  US{YOU COLLEEN} FROM THE LOVE OF GOD THAT IS IN CHRIST JESUS OUR LORD

    He who does not gather[all men into the love of God/slvation of all] scatters....

   Jude  v19  they said to you,in the last times there will be scoffers[who reject Grace]

 who will follow their own ungodly desires[these men are grumblers and fault-finders..they

follow their own evil desires,they boast about themselves]  THESE ARE THE MEN WHO DIVIDE

  YOU[scatter]

   

Offline marie glen

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2013, 08:48:31 PM »
`Wo to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye go round the sea and the dry land to make one proselyte, and whenever it may happen -- ye make him a son of gehenna twofold more than yourselves. - Matthew 23:15 (YLT)

I used the Young's Literal Translation for better perspective, than those using "hell" in place of "gehenna" (Valley of Hinnom)

Any thoughts as to exactly what Jesus is talking about from a UR perspective?

I'm glad you posted that from Young's Literal, as it points out "gehenna" is the word used.  ...can't remember if I've read it from Young's before or not and was assuming it was "the grave" translated as 'hell', but this throws a different light upon it! As gehenna was the trash pile or dump outside the wall of Israel.. So I guess it may very well mean that what they were teaching and passing on and making followers of, was worthless! :mthumbsup: (What they were teaching was "the law" with a LOT of man made commandments thrown in! Oiye!!)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2013, 09:10:42 PM by marie glen »
- Is it written? no repentance after death? if resurrected still in ones sins (2nd Resurrection) will be weeping and wailing? Holy Days - Trumpets, Atonement, Tabernacles prophecy the three peaks of His long 2nd advent? Is weeping & wailing the beginning of the redemptive process?
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- "...aLL things new" Rev21:5 "A new heavens and a new earth" Rev 21:1 - Is 11:7 Micah 4:4 Is 30:25
http://www.bubblews.com/news/9080033 -revelation told in rhyme - 45 days

Offline sheila

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2013, 09:33:58 PM »
...that's also associted with Baal worship..where they made their children pass through the fire

   in Elijah's day..people did not know the true God from Baal...and Elijah held a showdown of

 sorts ..as to who was the true God.

Offline marie glen

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2013, 09:56:55 PM »
I just had to cry and cry when I read WW's response. "It means they make ET's." So many times in the last three years I have wished I had remained in the false religion I had been in for so long before I came to the "Christian church". After the beautiful birth in my spirit of the grace of God the dilemma of the ET doctrine soon came to the forefront of of my mind and took me to the darkest place I have ever been. The ensuing mental breakdown and depression still has a hold on me today and everyday even after coming to UR truth. The demons still whisper "surely it is not so". Even on UR sites, doctrines of judgement and wrath and the second death torment me daily. I don't understand the weapons of our warfare. And I cry out "will this ever stop?"  That peace which passeth all understanding is gone and it's memory is fading. That joy with which I danced around my house and yard blessing God- gone. That desire to shout from the rooftops replaced with I'll never tell a soul. If I can save one person from going through the hell I'm living through it would be worth it. Please Lord, especially not my children, who I'm supposed to hate. Sick of it all!

hi, Colleen! I am so sorry to hear that! I read your post down a few too.. I used to struggle with very deep, very dark depression, which went on and on, yes, even after being "saved". Til one day the Lord stopped me - I was standing in front of a bookshelf - and He 'told' me "you are mourning the loss of your original family" - the light bulb turned on. I was estranged from my family, due to finances, but originally had moved about 1000 miles away because there were lots of abuses in childhood.. I had experienced much healing.. but during the years when my own children were little, things seemed to come back to haunt me. I didn't have all the time I'd had before to be in the Word, reading and having a lot of quiet prayer time.. (Which of course is very healing of itself.)

Things of course were much more demanding, even tiring. My husband, a truck driver, was over-the-road (OTR, now local hooray).. At low points after days of darkness/depression/oppression, I felt like I had been (spiritually) beat upon the head and back with a two by four.

Once the Lord revealed to me what I was "mourning", I could put a time limit on it! Say allow myself five, ten minutes to mourn it, then I could drop it and go on! It was long and drawn out before because it was nameless.. All this the Lord revealed to me. Also taught me to recognize different voices. How all things beautiful and perfect is from above and the Father of lights, and anything negative, especially if I can feel the negative, like a dart, knife or sword entering my heart or 'in the gut' as they say.. was something en-tire-ly different. He also taught me how to recognize threatening voices (spirits) and to reject them. I learned whenever I had a negative thought, i would imagine a huge X or maybe even 3 XXX's in my mind to cancel them (could even say "in the name of Jesus") and replace each negative thought with a positive one. Perhaps one opposite to the one its replacing.

Personally, I didn't find God in a church, but in the Rocky Mountains. :smile: I had been going around to libraries and researching world religions (looking for truth) and I also was studying astrology, and meditation. (Now it's just me and my Bible.)

So one day I was sitting at the side of a hill, and it seemed as though I could see a thought drift across the very blue sky, and it hit me in the head! :ghaha: Yes, it hit me in the head! What it said was "you've been learning about all the forces in the universe" (astrology) "what about the force that created the universe and what if that force has consciousness?" And I thought "GOD!" - My life changed from that day.. But it was that I could feel God's Presence when in the mountains, camping each weekend, but when not in the mountains.. no..  :bsad:

Until! One day I came across a Bible tract titled "God's Great Plan of Salvation". I read it and said the prayer four times. I just couldn't believe it tho. "Can this be true for me?" I asked, then went out to the living room (no one was home which was not usual). "Can it be true for me?" I asked.. then the sun, which was setting over the mountains to the west, streamed through an inch gap in the curtains, across the room and filled the off television screen with a radiant 8 rayed star. It was the star I used as a meditation symbol! I later learned this star is the one we see the 3 wise men (astrologers) follow every year at Christmas.. In the order of miracles, it may be tiny, but it worked for me!!

I learned over the years that other religions of the world are tapestries made up of both true and untrue threads.. And I learned if they didn't have any true threads to them, they would fall apart!! Over the years, I wish I would have continued with yoga! Wow, that stuff is great!! To this day I am still limber.. but for years I would do it maybe once every six months (the Lord I think tried to get me to do it more often!) But just doing it that much, and I could still bend over and touch the floor with the palms of my hands. I'm going to be 58 in May, and I cannot even touch the floor with my fingertips most days. But those stretches, I now might do if I turn on some music and dance.. are so healthy, especially if one does the deep breathing (of the breath of life, air). And praise God, in the East they visualize the light.. well, WHO is the Light? Yes many religions seek the light.. (It's easier to share our faith in Jesus, with others if we can begin on a little bit of common ground first...) Remember, the nations God warned Israel about were into human sacrifice and sex rites and babe sacrifice resulted. With them there was no common ground! :faint:
No thread of truth, it was all dark. (How much nicer if we would have become neighbors with the Native Americans here in the U.S. - they could have benefited us greatly.. Not a huGe jump to show them the Holy Spirit from the Great Spirit or our Father God. Rather than what occurred, trail of tears and aLL.)

To HATE sin..  refers to abhor the sin and anything which holds us back from our conversion.. to hate mother, father, brother, children if love/approval from them holds us back.. the Greek is Strong's #3404 which includes in its translation "by extension, to love less".

Looking in the concordance, under "hate" there are a lot more verses having to do with "love those who hate you"..

The verse:
Luke 14:(20)26-27 - Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

(20 and another said, A wife I married, and because of this I am not able to come...)

26 `If any one doth come unto me, and doth not hate his own father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brothers, and sisters, and yet even his own life, he is not able to be my disciple;

27 and whoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, is not able to be my disciple.

I think this simply means there is a certain amount of distance we may have with others because of our faith, we should not let it influence our following hard after Him. I don't think the man who married a wife (verse 20) was supposed to actually hate his wife but he was to love her less than Jesus. :gsmile:

The lies most effective against us, are those which are a twisting of God's own Word.

Personally, I had to pretty much 'make war' to overcome these things, by the washing of the (daily) Word and that close communion with Him.. By resisting the enemy and he would flee.. By knowing the dark voice from the light.. And had to deny the dark voice.. What is the verse "think on these things.." - "Whatsoever things are of good report.. whatsoever things are lovely.. think on these things" - I had to look it up - Philippians 4:8, perhaps others have already mentioned it..

Bless you! You will be in my prayers!
Oh, I almost forgot, I wanted to mention, I don't think the church and churches are lost! As a matter of fact, i think in many ways they surpass us of UR. I wouldn't let your joy you've had with your faith previous to UR pondering, be stolen! No way! :Peace2: "Contemplative prayer" ..is that Catholic, I have some Catholic in my roots.. there's true threads there too.. and saved! Seems to me, contemplative prayer would be the best prayer.. I'm a biG fan of Quietness (so quiet you can 'hear' the voice of God, find answers.. just my  :2c: ) :girlheart:

« Last Edit: April 06, 2013, 10:08:53 PM by marie glen »
- Is it written? no repentance after death? if resurrected still in ones sins (2nd Resurrection) will be weeping and wailing? Holy Days - Trumpets, Atonement, Tabernacles prophecy the three peaks of His long 2nd advent? Is weeping & wailing the beginning of the redemptive process?
``````````````````````````````````````````````````
- "...aLL things new" Rev21:5 "A new heavens and a new earth" Rev 21:1 - Is 11:7 Micah 4:4 Is 30:25
http://www.bubblews.com/news/9080033 -revelation told in rhyme - 45 days

Offline sheila

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2013, 10:11:46 PM »
Colleen...it is the lower waters out of the dragon's mouth that try to wash the woman away....

  but her HEAD/CHRIST is ABOVE THE WATERS...LISTEN TO HIS VOICE.............His is the voice

  in the CLOUDS OF HEAVEN...THE DRYING UP OF THE DRAGON FLOODS SPEWED ONTO

  THE EARTH.....He is a voice ABOVE MANY WATERS..do not listen to these lower waters

    He invites you to 'COME UP HERE"

   when He called me out..and come to inspect me one morning...He told me I had dragon breath

...because I was eating those doctrines of condemnation aagainst man..whom He has worked

A tonement for through His son...forgiveness of sin..not counting them against them....


Offline Colleen

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #14 on: April 06, 2013, 10:15:46 PM »
Thank you all for your kind words and thoughtful responses. You don't know how much they help! :HeartThrob:

Offline sheila

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #15 on: April 06, 2013, 10:21:57 PM »
 :Pray: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:

Offline lomarah

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #16 on: April 07, 2013, 12:44:17 AM »
 :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:
From Him and through Him and to Him are all things.

Offline eaglesway

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #17 on: April 07, 2013, 05:06:38 AM »
Sorry EW. I thought the reference would be clear: "If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple.
New Living Translation (©2007)

Then you said:For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, "Abba! Father!"
Well it seems to me that I must not be following the Spirit or be a son of God because I have this spirit of slavery leading to fear. I have it everyday! Sometimes all day.
 
I am supposed to try the spirits. When I thought I was in the spirit, speaking in tongues, I read that tongues is another language not some unintelligible babbling; that this same "speaking" is seen in heathen tribes all over the world.

When I was going within, because I read that that is where the kingdom of God is, I was warned that I was engaging in contemplative prayer.

I am a body worker who has worked with energy for years. Then I read these things are from the eastern religions and should not be practiced and that I was engaging in witchcraft. And I thought I was following the spirit.

These are just some of the things I am dealing with. It is overwhelming to say the least.

I am so sorry you lost your son! Thank you for taking time to respond to my post.

Your reference was clear, I was just trying to make the point that I think Jesus was saying, the best way to love our loved ones is to love God above all. :o)
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.webs.com

Offline CHB

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #18 on: April 07, 2013, 10:48:20 PM »
Quote from: eaglesway}
Your reference was clear, I was just trying to make the point that I think Jesus was saying, the best way to love our loved ones is to love God above all. :o)[/quote

Amen eaglesway. Preachers even get this wrong. They say "if you have a loved one who is sick you should leave them alone and come to Church, if you don't you love family more than God". Or you are putting family before God.

CHB


Offline ded2daworld

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2013, 01:01:47 AM »
Really all one is doing is putting family before "church" which is as it should be.
"Why do so many people think that the Bible is only inspired at certain points -  and that  THEY are inspired to pick out which points?"

Offline JBerton

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2013, 06:14:00 PM »
You are not supposed to hate your children!!??

God is Love!

If we are in God we will be walking in LOVE!

That is where the joy and peace comes from :o)

I lost my first born son a couple years ago, at the age of 30. He was not a believer! I praise God that long before he passed away, I knew that God's plan is the salvation of all :o) There is peace where there used to be fear. Hope where there used to be despair. Mercy where there used to be judgment. We hold the "good news" in our hearts and our hands!

There is no salvation in religion. No deliverance in "churchianity". It is only the grace of God and the shed blood of Jesus our savior and also the savior of the whole world -in God's time.

 In all wisdom and insight He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth. In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, to the end that we who were the first to hope in Christ would be to the praise of His glory.
(Eph 1:8-12)

God has let you in on His glorious secret!

For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, "Abba! Father!" The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him. For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us. For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it, in hope that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God.
(Rom 8:14-21)

I pray that you will be set free from every lying whisper, and the grace of God will abound in your faith, and that your rejoicing in this glorious "good news" will help set this futile world free, in your little corner of the world.
Grace to you and peace, in Jesus' name.

MAN THAT WAS SO BEAUTIFUL!!! :thumbsup:
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Offline JBerton

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Re: Twice the sons of Hell
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2013, 06:28:10 PM »
Colleen,
My heart went out to you when I read your reply about your anxieties, as I can well relate to you.  I have suffered the same thing, but maybe to a lesser degree.  I had a strong obsession with hell, which lead to anxiety and other related problems.  I sought help from a professional christian psychologist who helped me greatly through counseling (no medicine was required).  Through the years I have come to realize that the obsession was the tool by which God lead me to UR.  The suffering was no fun, but it was worth where God lead me to.  Therefore I am thankful for even those hard times in my life.  Now, whenever that old obsession raises it's ugly head, I have learned to ignore the discomfort, and trust in the Truth that the Spirit of God has lead me to - UR IS REAL AND TRUE!  HELL IS NOT REAL OR TRUE!  One day God will bring comfort to your heart and you will be overwhelmed by his love and grace!  PROMISE!
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