SERPENT Means " To learn from experience"?

[redhotmagma]

Whats the difference if He created an actual devil to torment us or our minds?  Both could be seen as morbid. 

[Beloved Servant]

Temptation comes from our own desires, which entice us and drag us away.

[redhotmagma]

He created us with our minds, aka "satan".  I don't see how that is any less cruel by God than creating an outside agent.

[Taffy]

He created us with our minds, aka "satan".  I don't see how that is any less cruel by God than creating an outside agent.

Amen Friend~

[Nathan]

The difference is, where we are in this carnality is not God's choosing.  Did he create carnality?  He created the universe in it's balance.  WE took that balance and perverted it.  Carnality is what it is because WE left the tree of life for it.  That's why it went from a serpent . . .in which Jesus states we can WALK ON and NOT BE HARMED . . .but because of us, we fed the serpent until it's become a dragon . . .God  didn't create the dragon, WE DID.

So yeah, there's a huge difference between thinking that God created Satan as an evil being set out to seek and destroy, and thinking that due to our over-emphasizing only specific aspects of the overall divine design of life, WE are the ones that let the lion loose, seeking whom it may devour.

There was a question along these same lines pertaining to Job and the setting there . . .my question back to that is, if God is a purifiying presence just by nature . . which I believe it truly is . . .death can not be in his presence . . .then how could it be that this satan tradition has inflated, can come and go from God's presence and NOT be affected by him at all?  Who is more powerful here . . .God?  Or their version of satan??

[Molly]

Satan does have a lot of power, and is very dangerous, especially in these end times, as he knows his time is short.

So should we underestimate that?  I don't think so.

People have gone to sleep, have stopped being vigilant,  and look at what has happened.

When they wake up they are going to be furious at how they have been duped.

But whose fault is that?  God's or theirs?

[redhotmagma]

The difference is, where we are in this carnality is not God's choosing.  Did he create carnality?  He created the universe in it's balance.  WE took that balance and perverted it.  Carnality is what it is because WE left the tree of life for it.  That's why it went from a serpent . . .in which Jesus states we can WALK ON and NOT BE HARMED . . .but because of us, we fed the serpent until it's become a dragon . . .God  didn't create the dragon, WE DID.

So yeah, there's a huge difference between thinking that God created Satan as an evil being set out to seek and destroy, and thinking that due to our over-emphasizing only specific aspects of the overall divine design of life, WE are the ones that let the lion loose, seeking whom it may devour.

There was a question along these same lines pertaining to Job and the setting there . . .my question back to that is, if God is a purifiying presence just by nature . . which I believe it truly is . . .death can not be in his presence . . .then how could it be that this satan tradition has inflated, can come and go from God's presence and NOT be affected by him at all?  Who is more powerful here . . .God?  Or their version of satan??

We could substitute Lucifer in to your response here and get the same conclusion God didn't create him that way He became the devil.  Also that still doesn't take away the fact that God created the ability for the carnal mind to take over.  If the potential is there He created it.  You said God didn't create the dragon we did, well He created the serpent then, if it is the mind He's still the first cause.

I'm just playing carnal minds advocate here 

[thinktank]

Yes. What puzzles me is that some find an entity of a dragon, repulsive and a misrepresentation of God, but yet are willing to entertain the idea of the same entity within their own minds, the adversary, created by God.

[Nathan]

The difference is, where we are in this carnality is not God's choosing.  Did he create carnality?  He created the universe in it's balance.  WE took that balance and perverted it.  Carnality is what it is because WE left the tree of life for it.  That's why it went from a serpent . . .in which Jesus states we can WALK ON and NOT BE HARMED . . .but because of us, we fed the serpent until it's become a dragon . . .God  didn't create the dragon, WE DID.

So yeah, there's a huge difference between thinking that God created Satan as an evil being set out to seek and destroy, and thinking that due to our over-emphasizing only specific aspects of the overall divine design of life, WE are the ones that let the lion loose, seeking whom it may devour.

There was a question along these same lines pertaining to Job and the setting there . . .my question back to that is, if God is a purifiying presence just by nature . . which I believe it truly is . . .death can not be in his presence . . .then how could it be that this satan tradition has inflated, can come and go from God's presence and NOT be affected by him at all?  Who is more powerful here . . .God?  Or their version of satan??

We could substitute Lucifer in to your response here and get the same conclusion God didn't create him that way He became the devil.  Also that still doesn't take away the fact that God created the ability for the carnal mind to take over.  If the potential is there He created it.  You said God didn't create the dragon we did, well He created the serpent then, if it is the mind He's still the first cause.

I'm just playing carnal minds advocate here 

Oh yeah . . . you could easily substitute Lucifer there . . but . . .for me it's because Lucifer isn't the devil as tradition holds.  I believe Lucifer is Adam . . .

How about this analogy . . .God created a battery.  Inside it is all the power that runs the earth.  But in order for us to tap into that power, we have to take a hold of both the positve and the negative.  But the moment the negative cable is approached, it becomes the emphasis.  But the purpose of it is to bring balance to the entire circutry.

So, you want to embrace satan but no eternal hell?  What happens to satan in the end then?  Because that's one of the bigger cheers the ET'rs carry around with them as they boast of his destruction along with all those other lost souls who are going to get what they got coming to them. 

How can you justify no hell but still hang on to satan?

[micah7:9]

Well as usual and probably for the better I am LOST again.

[redhotmagma]

Nathan I'm not embracing Satan, I actually am up in the air here.  I'm just saying that your reasoning seems flawed.  By lucifer I meant the standard interpretation.  You're saying we created the dragon God didn't.  Ok but God created the mind which you claim is the serpent that becomes the dragon.  Now instead of mind put angel, and instead of dragon put the devil.  The scenario is the same thing as far as God's culpability in it. 

I DO NOT believe lucifer is satan, but is Adam, I'm not so sure about whether satan is an outside spirit or our mind.

Also you said that God didn't create darkness, or an evil being

Isa 45:7 I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create evil; I, the LORD, do all these things .’

I'm not trying to nit pick here, just understand

[Taffy]

Isa 45:7   I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things]. 

The Lord did Indeed Create Darkness[ Ignorance] as The earth he created was IN DARKNESS## ALL things COMEfrom HIM##Im sure Nate will have his own say ~ But Darkness and Light are the Same to The [ Lord]
~

Darkness came through the carnal Mind who HE MADE~

[micah7:9]

Isa 45:7   I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things]. 

The Lord did Indeed Create Darkness[ Ignorance] as The earth he created was IN DARKNESS## ALL things COMEfrom HIM##Im sure Nate will have his own say ~ But Darkness and Light are the Same to The [ Lord]
~

Darkness came through the carnal Mind who HE MADE~

Friend you certainly do have a way at looking at things. You might want to clean your speck's once in awhile. Just a thought.
Darkness is only ignorance when you see things from the earthy. Darkness is only LIGHT at its lowest lumen.

[Taffy]

Isa 45:7   I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things]. 

The Lord did Indeed Create Darkness[ Ignorance] as The earth he created was IN DARKNESS## ALL things COMEfrom HIM##Im sure Nate will have his own say ~ But Darkness and Light are the Same to The [ Lord]
~

Darkness came through the carnal Mind who HE MADE~

Friend you certainly do have a way at looking at things. You might want to clean your speck's once in awhile. Just a thought.
Darkness is only ignorance when you see things from the earthy. Darkness is only LIGHT at its lowest lumen.

and who created it?~Iask a SIMPLE QUESTION~WHO?

[micah7:9]

You are not really asking me who created darkness are you? I mean are you?

[Taffy]

what was discussed Micah was Darkness , if you have been following the Previous couple Of Posts~~ but if  you Have a Direct question please share?

[Beloved Servant]

               Darkness and Light

Exodus 14:19-21 (Amplified Bible)
19 And the Angel of God Who went before the host of Israel moved and went behind them; and the pillar of the cloud went from before them and stood behind them,
20 Coming between the host of Egypt and the host of Israel. It was a cloud and darkness to the Egyptians, but it gave light by night to the Israelites; and the one host did not come near the other all night.
21 Then Moses stretched out his hand over the sea, and the Lord caused the sea to go back by a strong east wind all that night and made the sea dry land; and the waters were divided.



Exodus 20:20-22 (Amplified Bible)
20And Moses said to the people, Fear not; for God has come to prove you, so that the reverential fear of Him may be before you, that you may not sin.
21 And the people stood afar off, but Moses drew near to the thick darkness where God was.
22 And the Lord said to Moses, Thus shall you say to the Israelites, You have seen for yourselves that I have talked with you from heaven.


Deuteronomy 5:22-24 (Amplified Bible)
22 These words the Lord spoke to all your assembly at the mountain out of the midst of the fire, the cloud, and the thick darkness, with a loud voice; and He spoke not again [added no more]. He wrote them on two tables of stone and gave them to me [Moses].
23 And when you heard the voice out of the midst of the darkness, while the mountain was burning with fire, you came near me, all the heads of your tribes and your elders;
24 And you said, Behold, the Lord our God has shown us His glory and His greatness, and we have heard His voice out of the midst of the fire; we have this day seen that God speaks with man and man still lives.



THE UNVEILING OF JESUS CHRIST (CLV)
4 And they shall be seeing His face, and His name shall be on their foreheads.
5 And night shall be no more, and they have no need of lamplight and sunlight, for the Lord God shall be illuminating them.
And they shall be reigning for the eons of the eons.
6 And he said to me, "These sayings are faithful and true. And the Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, commissions His messenger to show to His slaves what must occur swiftly.

[micah7:9]

what was discussed Micah was Darkness , if you have been following the Previous couple Of Posts~~ but if  you Have a Direct question please share?

No not really. I have found that one just has to throw something in and let it bounce. It has been my experience that the main post has really nothing to do with the discussion, most times the thread is lost after about 4-5 posts. So no, not really.
Let me see "SERPENT Means "To learn from experience"?

[Taffy]

what was discussed Micah was Darkness , if you have been following the Previous couple Of Posts~~ but if  you Have a Direct question please share?

No not really. I have found that one just has to throw something in and let it bounce. It has been my experience that the main post has really nothing to do with the discussion, most times the thread is lost after about 4-5 posts. So no, not really.
Let me see "SERPENT Means "To learn from experience"?

Topics diverse as Christ is ONE HUGE subject## so let them Flow where the spirit leads Us~but that JUST me,not  the general rule of thumb of this Forum~well I suppose this is the thread I was given to start so Flow My man~

well again Look to the Root word Dear Scholar and I find we see it means to Learn by e3xperience or diligently Observe~

[Beloved Servant]

Deceitful speech.

The cloven tongue confused in Genesis, and the cloven tongue confuses today.

[Taffy]

Deceitful speech.

The cloven tongue confused in Genesis, and the cloven tongue confuses today.

the Tongue which Breathes Lies~who believe its TRUTH# such is the DRUG of witchcraft and the bewitched MIND~

[micah7:9]

Yeah now I can dig that! Hey, not to be frivolous but what is the "#" mean in your posts?

[Taffy]

Yeah now I can dig that! Hey, not to be frivolous but what is the "#" mean in your posts?

 My uncrontrolled Digit pressing the wrong KEY~ it needs Training

[Beloved Servant]

serpent, lol,
forked tongue!

[Beloved Servant]

...so obvious!