No man enters heaven

[Molly]

Oh, excuse me then.  I must have misunderstood what you meant by "errant, contradictory, and falsehoods."  Maybe you could reword it for me so I could understand better.

I  do not need to reword what I stated. I am not responsible for your opinion as you choose to read my remarks and then arrive at the opinion they reflect the intent to bash the Bible. Stating facts is not bashing.
My signature reflects my opinion. It is a quote copied from the Tent maker website. I think if someone cares to do the research they will find the evidence to suit themselves. Or not.


Or one could venture to Tentmaker.org and read the articles there. Article 1, the myth of the Bible, is a good start I would think.  Or perhaps one could research what Biblical scholars have to say. Professor Bart Ehrman's work, one of many BS, comes to mind.

I do hope that helps your understanding.
God Bless.

So are you saying it's a fact that the Bible is errant, contradictory, and contains falsehoods?

[jabcat]

LD, I've talked with Gary before when another member had made similar statements regarding his writings on the site, and his response generally was that was not his intent (to "diminish" the scriptures) and he believed his statements had been misinterpreted to present a view of the scriptures that he doesn't actually have.  He has said repeatedly that he wants there to be a respect for the scriptures in the discussion forum.

Before we move forward in this particular discussion, please review the following link;

http://tentmaker.org/forum/rules-and-faq/moderatortm-expectations-regarding-the-scriptures/msg84791/#msg84791

Thanks, James.

[jabcat]

p.s.  I'm also in the process of contacting Gary to see if there's anything he wants to add or perhaps clarify.  Thanks.

[LordsDaughter]

James,
 My intention in replying to the OP author who implied their confusion about whether or not a soul enters Heaven after death, was not in any way intending to disrespect scripture.
Rather, it was to relate an understanding, an accord if you will, that in reading the scripture it is very easy to be confused as to what is the answer to that inquiry. As there are varying scriptures that relate two different points. As I demonstrated in brief in my initial reply.

I do not see what Scholars have noted about scripture, being there are no autographs available for review today, as the final canonized version that's come down to us as the KJV, and other versions, being errant, contradictory our false as disrespectful of scripture.

As noted in my reply above, with an excerpt from the Bible Myth article at Tent Maker.org, and as my signature relates and as was copied from TM.org itself, it is understandable that throughout the generations the varying interpretations and translations of scripture through the ages from Hebrew, Latin, Greek, Aramaic, would lose something in the process.
Personally, and with all respect, I do not think it serves as spiritual manna to ignore what Biblical Scholars alone have noted regarding the errant factor of the written words of men within the Bible. As the Tent Maker site itself noted, in the excerpt above while paraphrasing here, the Holy Spirit speaks to the faithful innately.

Certainly, speaking to what Gary himself noted on his own site is not bashing. Rather it is reiterating what he's noted about the Bible itself. If his intention was not to communicate what he wrote there I agree with you in that perhaps he should make a correction so that his true intent is made clear. As it stands what I've read of his articles thus far does not substantiate a fundamentalist evangelical point of view.
I don't think a new member can be held responsible for inferring his point of view from what he himself is responsible for posting on his own site so that the reader may thus be informed accordingly.

I appreciate your insight and look forward to Gary's input.

God Bless.

[jabcat]

I've emailed Gary for his comments and to see if there are any clarifications he'd like to make and/or have input in general re: the discussion.

In the meantime, let's please continue to operate in the discussion forum as noted in the link I provided.  Thanks, James.

[jabcat]

Gary responded that the link to TM Expectations re: the scriptures "pretty much sums it up".  He also offered to correspond by email to answer any specific questions about it.  He can be reached at gary@tentmaker.org.

Thanks, James.

[eaglesway]

I think it is easy enough to clarify if one believes that the errors we are dealing with are related to mistranslation and the morphology of language and the theological prejudices of certain translations- on the one hand

and a belief in the integrity of the scriptures when presented as they were, spoken by the Spirit as expressions of the Logos, the mind of Christ, the image of the invisible God, on the other hand.

The Spirit certainly does "innately" explain things to the faithful, which is how I was able, eventually, to overcome the devastating errors (both purposeful and accidental) of the primary English translations and reach an understanding that God would have no man suffer forever and that the Lord Jesus Christ would eventually redeem and restore all of creation.

I do however also thank God that through the use of interlinears and parrallels and lexicons and dictionaries a mediocre student such as myself could find the clear truth presented in the scriptures as they were meant to be.

I am also thankful that God is not really all uptight about what anyone believes about how time works or doesnt, or how sheol or heaven mesh or don't or how and when one sleeps or wakes in relation to that DAY when the veil is rent and every eye shall see Him and exactly how we experience it after physical death.

"We see through a glass darkly", said Paul, a man who had been caught up to the third heaven and heard words so transcendent he could not repeat them among men.

Love one another says John.

Peace y'all

[LordsDaughter]

I think it is easy enough to clarify if one believes that the errors we are dealing with are related to mistranslation and the morphology of language and the theological prejudices of certain translations- on the one hand

and a belief in the integrity of the scriptures when presented as they were, spoken by the Spirit as expressions of the Logos, the mind of Christ, the image of the invisible God, on the other hand.

The Spirit certainly does "innately" explain things to the faithful, which is how I was able, eventually, to overcome the devastating errors (both purposeful and accidental) of the primary English translations and reach an understanding that God would have no man suffer forever and that the Lord Jesus Christ would eventually redeem and restore all of creation.

I do however also thank God that through the use of interlinears and parrallels and lexicons and dictionaries a mediocre student such as myself could find the clear truth presented in the scriptures as they were meant to be.

I am also thankful that God is not really all uptight about what anyone believes about how time works or doesnt, or how sheol or heaven mesh or don't or how and when one sleeps or wakes in relation to that DAY when the veil is rent and every eye shall see Him and exactly how we experience it after physical death.

"We see through a glass darkly", said Paul, a man who had been caught up to the third heaven and heard words so transcendent he could not repeat them among men.

Love one another says John.

Peace y'all

Thank you for putting my point of view in a different way. Well said! All of it actually, but particularly that part. Perhaps your phrasing will help to clear the glass. ;)

God Bless.