Author Topic: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"  (Read 12484 times)

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Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #50 on: April 22, 2011, 09:48:13 PM »
Micah, I don't believe the serpent is the carnal mind.

I believe there were three in the garden in Gen 3.

I believe the carnal mind is susceptible to the serpent.

But we have the mind of Christ.
--1 Cor 2:16

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #51 on: April 22, 2011, 09:53:51 PM »


Spirit, soul and body?

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #52 on: April 22, 2011, 10:42:24 PM »
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #53 on: April 22, 2011, 10:57:08 PM »


Spirit, soul and body?
It could be.  I mean it works.  But, it reduces Gen 2 and 3 to allegory.  And, to my mind, it also maligns the humans, and God.

allegory
Noun
1. A story, poem, or picture that can be interpreted to reveal a hidden meaning, typically a moral or political one.
2. The genre to which such works belong.

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #54 on: April 22, 2011, 11:00:41 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #55 on: April 22, 2011, 11:07:49 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #56 on: April 22, 2011, 11:13:43 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #57 on: April 22, 2011, 11:17:26 PM »


Taffy, Are you saying that WE are the Garden of God?

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #58 on: April 22, 2011, 11:18:32 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
But they were in the garden.  So how does that work?  They somehow acquired the carnal mind in the garden?  How did the carnal mind get inside the garden if it can't be there?
« Last Edit: April 22, 2011, 11:22:02 PM by Molly »

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #59 on: April 22, 2011, 11:25:55 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
But they were in the garden.  So how does that work?  They somehow acquired the carnal mind in the garden?  How did the carnal mind get inside the garden if it can't be there?

 do you consider them perfect prior to the sin?--- it was the sin was caused the exit---were going HOME for mine Molly---
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline thinktank

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #60 on: April 22, 2011, 11:27:30 PM »
I think he means that the carnal mind cannot access the spiritual riches that are found in the garden. That only the mind of Christ can reach that place.
 :2c:

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #61 on: April 22, 2011, 11:34:12 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
But they were in the garden.  So how does that work?  They somehow acquired the carnal mind in the garden?  How did the carnal mind get inside the garden if it can't be there?

 do you consider them perfect prior to the sin?--- it was the sin was caused the exit---were going HOME for mine Molly---
Yes, I do think they were created perfect--in the sense that they were created to be in union with Christ.  Satan usurped that role.  Jesus bought it back.

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #62 on: April 22, 2011, 11:35:39 PM »
I think he means that the carnal mind cannot access the spiritual riches that are found in the garden. That only the mind of Christ can reach that place.
 :2c:
Yes, I understand what he's saying, but they were there.

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #63 on: April 22, 2011, 11:37:45 PM »


Taffy, Are you saying that WE are the Garden of God?
SOME ONE ASKED - WHAT IS THE KINGDOM of GOD like
It seems a Man PLANTED a Mustard seed in a GARDEN and it GREW like a GREAT TREE#

songs of Solomon SPEAK a Lot about aa GARDEN---


 Sgs 4:15   A fountain of gardens, a well of living waters, and streams from Lebanon. 


 Sgs 4:16  Awake, O north wind;[ Judgment comes from the NORTH] and come, thou south; blow upon my garden, [that] the spices thereof may flow out. Let my beloved come into his garden, and eat his pleasant fruits

WE Just maybe Beloved Servant :HeartThrob:
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #64 on: April 22, 2011, 11:39:21 PM »


In Genesis 3:1 we read, "Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?" The word serpent in our language comes from the Latin serpo meaning "to creep," but the Hebrew term has no relation to the form or motion of any external attribute of a serpent The word used here for serpent is the Hebrew word NACHASH which is a primitive root meaning "to his or whisper." It, furthermore, means "to search or scrutinize closely, to find out by experiment, to practice divination, augury, incantation or enchantment." According to Webster incantation means "the chanting of special words or a formula in magic spells or rites," Incantation may speak in addition of hypnotism. The Serpent, then, is a HISSER, a WHISPERER, a DIVINER, an EXPERIMENTER, an ENCHANTER, a MAGICIAN, and a HYPNOTIST! And, I might add, so is the carnal mind!

In Isaiah 8:19 the Holy Spirit has recorded for our learning a most significant exhortation. "And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? For the living to the dead?" The same inspired prophet penned a prophecy concerning Jerusalem under the prophetic term "Ariel," saying, "Thou shalt be brought down, and shalt speak out of the ground, and thy speech shall be low out of the dust, and thy voice shall be... out of the ground, and thy speech shall whisper out of the dust" (Isa. 29: 4). Here we read of spirits that "peep and mutter," which speak "out of the ground" and "whisper out of the dust." Is this not reminiscent of the Serpent in Eden, the hisser and whisperer, calling to Eve and speaking hypnotically from the dust realm?

Whisperings out of the dust – there is something sinister in the thought, but beyond the evil that is suggested, there is also the thought of subtle suggestion – a whispered temptation – something so subtle one could wonder from whence it comes, a word so low and so whispered as to be almost imperceptible —or is it a thought, a desire, a command from an inner nature These whisperings ARISE FROM THE DUST OF THE CARNAL MIND, OUT OF THE GROUND OF THE ADAM NATURE where lies the Serpent! It is significant to note that "the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made" (Gen. 3: 1). The contrast is drawn between the Garden and the field Adam lived and walked in the Garden, and his responsibility was to "dress and keep it." Garden is from the Hebrew GAN, meaning a fenced or protected area. It was, furthermore, cultivated and tended. Field is from the Hebrew SADEH, indicating that which is spread out; flat land; wild farm or wilderness. The field where the Serpent dwelt was an unfenced and uncultivated area. This field bespeaks of the mind of the flesh – the unbroken, unharnessed, unbridled, untended, unplowed, unprocessed, undisciplined, unprotected sphere from whence the Serpent "whispered out of the dust" – the subtle voice whispering enticingly from the unexplored wildlands of the FLESH! This whisper, this tantalizing hiss is communicated through the thoughts, reasoning, desires, passions, plans, hopes, fantasies and cravings of the CARNAL MIND! In the first age of Adam's creation, God used the Serpent to reveal what lay dormant, undiscovered and uncultivated within man's innermost being – a CUNNING NATURE – EGO – SELFHOOD independent of God. If by the grace of God you can see the truth of this, you will then plainly discern in all the propensities of the carnal mind the CREEPING, SLITHERING, WHISPERING, DIVINING, ENCHANTING, HYPNOTIZING SERPENT OF EDEN!

Before pursuing this thought, we do well to consider also the word translated "subtle" in this passage. "Now the serpent was more subtle than any best of the field." The Hebrew word for "naked" in Gen. 2: 25 is AROM. The English word that describes the Serpent's nature in Gen. 3: 1 is "subtle," and the Hebrew word here is ARUM. Both AROM and ARUM are derived from ARAM which means "to be bare, to be cunning" Hebrew scholars say that originally these three words were the same word – ARAM. Now, why should the expression "naked" and the term "cunning" be the same word? What is the connection? We can answer with only one word: SEDUCTIVE. By way of illustration, a naked woman may be a seductive woman. There is a close connection between the two. The ideas of naked and cunning come together in the word SEDUCTIVE or SEDUCE. Can we not see by this that the Serpent was actually more seductive than anything in the bestial realm. Ah! the mind of the flesh is, in truth, the most seductive thing in the world!
       
         — Preston Eby
         ECHOES FROM EDEN Part XXXII
         www.kingdombiblestudies.org/Echoes/echoes32.htm



Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #65 on: April 22, 2011, 11:40:23 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
But they were in the garden.  So how does that work?  They somehow acquired the carnal mind in the garden?  How did the carnal mind get inside the garden if it can't be there?

 do you consider them perfect prior to the sin?--- it was the sin was caused the exit---were going HOME for mine Molly---
Yes, I do think they were created perfect--in the sense that they were created to be in union with Christ.  Satan usurped that role.  Jesus bought it back.

I just hope The lord doesnt GOOF again when we have spirtual Bodies ans so call REBELL----
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #66 on: April 22, 2011, 11:44:31 PM »
Yes, I agree with that--the garden is hidden inside of us now, which mystery was hidden from the ages but revealed to the Gentiles by Paul--Christ in you, the hope of glory. [Col 1: 27]

Which also again explains why he can enter in to us and commune with us.

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #67 on: April 22, 2011, 11:45:21 PM »


The Song of Solomon speaks of THREE gardens:
THE GARDEN OF FLOWERS
THE GARDEN OF SPICES
THE GARDEN OF NUTS

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #68 on: April 22, 2011, 11:51:31 PM »
Yes, I agree with that--the garden is hidden inside of us now, which mystery was hidden from the ages but revealed to the Gentiles by Paul--Christ in you, the hope of glory. [Col 1: 27]

Which also again explains why he can enter in to us and commune with us.

it was Inside ADAM but was LOCKED out like ALL MEN---THANKS Molly :icon_flower:
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #69 on: April 22, 2011, 11:52:16 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
But they were in the garden.  So how does that work?  They somehow acquired the carnal mind in the garden?  How did the carnal mind get inside the garden if it can't be there?

 do you consider them perfect prior to the sin?--- it was the sin was caused the exit---were going HOME for mine Molly---
Yes, I do think they were created perfect--in the sense that they were created to be in union with Christ.  Satan usurped that role.  Jesus bought it back.

I just hope The lord doesnt GOOF again when we have spirtual Bodies ans so call REBELL----
He didn't goof.  He had a plan. 

It was always intended that we would need a Savior.

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #70 on: April 22, 2011, 11:53:35 PM »


Someone needed to show us the way.
He had to do it Himself.

Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #71 on: April 22, 2011, 11:56:54 PM »
Ibelieve Genesis Is allegory---- the THREE as you say in the Garden-- ADAM, eve being HIS soul shown as HIS MIND and what Takes Place within----THEREFORE- 3 making ONE-JUST MY TWO PENNIES molly :icon_flower:
I know you do.  That's ok.  I'm just saying, I don't. :icon_flower:

When the LORD God kicked the man and woman out of the garden, someone else went outside with them--the LORD.

I consider that real, not allegory.

the carnal man \mind DOESNT have  access to the garden Molly but HE never leaves US
But they were in the garden.  So how does that work?  They somehow acquired the carnal mind in the garden?  How did the carnal mind get inside the garden if it can't be there?

 do you consider them perfect prior to the sin?--- it was the sin was caused the exit---were going HOME for mine Molly---
Yes, I do think they were created perfect--in the sense that they were created to be in union with Christ.  Satan usurped that role.  Jesus bought it back.

I just hope The lord doesnt GOOF again when we have spirtual Bodies ans so call REBELL----
He didn't goof.  He had a plan. 

It was always intended that we would need a Savior.

ya Miss the POINT -- are you now saying HE planned satan who is supposed have had His creation but and fell although a SPIRIT--how on earth can you destroy a SPIRIT---the Mind boggles???-No The Lord never FAILED - you know the other day Iheard some one say Satan committed sucide-- Ive never laughed so much in my days--- of subject--- time to move on
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline Molly

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #72 on: April 23, 2011, 12:01:11 AM »
Yes, I agree with that--the garden is hidden inside of us now, which mystery was hidden from the ages but revealed to the Gentiles by Paul--Christ in you, the hope of glory. [Col 1: 27]

Which also again explains why he can enter in to us and commune with us.

it was Inside ADAM but was LOCKED out like ALL MEN---THANKS Molly :icon_flower:
  Adam was in the garden, but when he was locked out, he was hidden in Christ, and Christ and the garden hidden in him.

That is how the Word of God could appear to and talk to men in the OT.

Satan thought he had won, but it was a pyrrhic victory.


Song of Solomon 4:12
A garden inclosed is my sister, my spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed.





Offline Taffy

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #73 on: April 23, 2011, 12:03:02 AM »
sorry I must share this- he told me that SATAN came down and used the Body of the SERPENT to speak through----so one could help to answer well If the SERPENt, the great Dragon IS satan-- are you saying that Satan who no longer has a BODY popped into the Garden and JUMPED into HIS own Body he didnt have------ excuse me while i do a Bro willie cause for sure this utter nonsence  :thumbdown:  :laughing7:
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

Offline thinktank

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Re: Matt 10:28 "destroy body and soul"
« Reply #74 on: April 23, 2011, 12:04:35 AM »
You mean this scripture Molly

Revelation 13:8
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

The world was created before men according to Genesis, regardless of how old the world is or whether it was re created.

Unless it is talking about the world. I.e The sinful world, the world that God speaks of when he says things such as Mine are in the world but not of the world. Or the world heareth them.

If God is talking about the foundation of the fallen world, rather than the foundation of the created earth, then there is a possibility that the plan to send Jesus to die was AFTER the serpent beguiled Adam and Eve. Which means it's a possibility that it was planned to slay the lamb only if Adam and Eve failed.