Author Topic: THINK.  (Read 16639 times)

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Offline Peacetroll

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THINK.
« on: January 24, 2008, 04:27:22 PM »
If Universal Salvation were true,

Why did the prophets and apostles put their lives and their loved one's lives in jeapardy every day? :dontknow:

It's counter-intuitive to place your family, your children and your friends lives in harms way when all shall be saved in the end regardless of their actions and beliefs. :mshock:

THINK.
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

laren

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2008, 05:16:42 PM »
If Universal Salvation were true,

Why did the prophets and apostles put their lives and their loved one's lives in jeapardy every day? :dontknow:

It's counter-intuitive to place your family, your children and your friends lives in harms way when all shall be saved in the end regardless of their actions and beliefs. :mshock:

THINK.

To reveal the TRUTH that the Father's love is not dependent upon self works through sacrifice. 

Out of love, baptized for the dead. 

 

laren

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2008, 05:25:23 PM »
Gen 12:3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.


blessed:

1) to bless, kneel

a) (Qal)

1) to kneel
2) to bless

b) (Niphal) to be blessed, bless oneself

c) (Piel) to bless

d) (Pual) to be blessed, be adored

e) (Hiphil) to cause to kneel

f) (Hithpael) to bless oneself

2) (TWOT) to praise, salute, curse


Every knee will bow....


bow


1) to bend, bow, the knee (the knees)

a) to one

1) in honour of one

2) in religious veneration

b) used of worshippers

2) to bow one's self




Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2008, 05:28:45 PM »
 :Chinscratch: thinking
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Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2008, 05:29:27 PM »
 :Chinscratch: thinking
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Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2008, 05:29:48 PM »
 :Chinscratch: thinking
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Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2008, 05:30:31 PM »
What was the question?
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Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2008, 05:31:17 PM »
Hoo boy I really am dumb
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Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2008, 05:31:46 PM »
There is no hope!
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Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2008, 05:35:39 PM »
Hey Eric

You keep starting topics.  You get rebuttled and then just move on.

And then it is the same old verbiage again and again and again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again again and again

Don't you know some good apologists that know how to discuss?

Really you are getting soooooo boring.

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Dreamer

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2008, 06:04:21 PM »
PT, when you propose such questions it demonstrates why God cannot and does not reveal UR to the masses.  Not everyone can handle it or be trusted with it.  It seems that if you were convinced of UR, it would drive you mad. God is preserving your mind until you are ready.  :HeartThrob:

Offline Peacetroll

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2008, 06:35:04 PM »
 What rebuttal?    What scriptural answer?

Why would they endure all that the Saints endured for the truth?

WHY would they go through what Paul says they did?  Why did he?

Hebrews 11:36And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment:

 37They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented;

 38(Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.

Sawn asunder!  Remember what the rabbis say happened to Isaiah?They sawed him asunder.


[Isaiah] thereupon pronounced [the Divine] Name and was swallowed up by a cedar. The cedar, however, was brought and sawn asunder. When the saw reached his month he died. [And this was his penalty] for having said, 'And I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips'. (Babylonian Talmud, Yebamoth 49b, Soncino Edition).


The rabbis claim that Isaiah was killed by having his own mouth sawed in half because he chastised the Israelites for their unclean lips. The rabbis have it that it was Isaiah who was wrong, not Israel.

Why would the martyers of God go through this if , all children of Light, and children of Darkness will recieve salvation?

There would be no point.  Absolutely NO point to suffer and allow their families to suffer so much if in the end, all will have clarity and complete understanding anyhow.

It would be like trying to make a difference in a dream, when in a few moments  you'll wake up anyhow and understand everything crystal clear as will the others characters in your dream, therefore it's only common sense to see the fallacy in such motivation as you propose.

Once again, I'm not necessarily asking you to think Seeker, for you would certainly oppose me if you could in the simple truth of  2 + 2 being 4 if you had the ability.


 
« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 06:55:07 PM by Peacetroll »
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

laren

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2008, 06:49:23 PM »
 
2Cr 5:14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: 




2Cr 4:12  So then death worketh in us, but life in you

Offline CHB

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2008, 07:11:04 PM »

Think about this, why were they tortured, sawn asunder and the like? Because of what they believed.

We today would be done the same if all of us who believed in the salvation of all proclaimed it to the world. Paul preached grace, not law, Jesus broke the law that is why they killed him. We who believe in the salvation of all preach grace without works. 

PeaceTroll, do you believe in grace with out works? Do you believe that there is something that you do that saves you?

CHB

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2008, 07:15:37 PM »
Peacetroll,

Are you saying dying for a god that would have unbelievers on their knees begging not be be roasted and obliterated is more worthy of your sacrifice and endurance than a God that would have those same people, now in the image of Christ, not on their knees begging for mercy, but on their knees thanking Him for His mercy?

We tend to pattern ourselves (or at least strive to) after the god we worship.  You seem like a patient, somewhat gentle person -- in the sense that I've never seen you go off even in the midst of all the people here that disagree with you, so I'm puzzled as to why the god you've fashioned seem so different from you.

I believe that Christ is the Savior of the world.  Why should that fact cause me not to endure?  Why would it cause our forebrothers not to endure?   

Let me ask you -- what is your motivation for enduring?  Is it love for God and your wanting to please Him or is it just to save your hind particles?

Offline Peacetroll

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2008, 07:51:36 PM »
Thank you CHB and Dreamer for your comments and input as well as your questions.  I always appreciate conversation regarding scripture and most of all discussion on the truths regarding the true God expressed and manifested in the flesh as Jesus Christ.

I'll try to take each of your concerns and points in chronological order, and I'll do my best to answer with the logic that has been given to me and at the same time try as much as I can to see things once again from your point of view (For I was a URist without even knowing the term from a child until I was 36 years old, so I understand where you are coming from and I also empathize with your tenacity and grip you have on  your current ideology).

First to reply to CHB and his comments/questions.
Quote
Think about this, why were they tortured, sawn asunder and the like? Because of what they believed.


CHB.  I mean absolutley no offence, but you revealed the obvious.  Obviously they are killed for their belief.  The belief that you and I confess to be striving to learn and obtain.

I'm simply saying, IF they believed that 'all homo-sapiens were going to ultimately be saved' then why did they bother arguing with others to the point of being murdered?  To the point of leaving their wives widows and their children fatherless, when they could have just shut-up and beared it, seeing how in the end they too would be saved and all things would be clear and content? 

I'm saying it is counter-intuitive and I'm amazed I never realized it for 36 years, so I'm not counting on you all grasping my position, yet.

Quote
We today would be done the same if all of us who believed in the salvation of all proclaimed it to the world
.CHB

I don't think so.  First off URist have a tendency to be bashful when calling evil deeds evil and/or opposing evil men (their fruits being exposing who they are).

The true prophets and apostles died because they hated evil, exposed it and pointed their finger at the rich and greedy of the world and said 'you vipers, how shall you escape the damnation of hell??'.

I don't believe for one second that the rich and elite of John the baptists days could care less about what he actually believed.  Herod had John killed (or allowed it), because of his INFLUENCE on others and indirectly his influence on Herod and the Pharisee's money machine.

Quote
Paul preached grace, not law, Jesus broke the law that is why they killed him. We who believe in the salvation of all preach grace without works. 
CHB

Paul did preace grace, and mercy and predestination too.  Jesus broke the law????????????????????????  That's why they killed him???????????????

I could write a whole chapter on that, but I'm not gonna.  The 'earthy' reason Jesus died was because he harmed the Pharisee's money making scheme in the Temple.  The 'spiritual' reason was because the principalities of the air way thought he was the heir and they could kill him and gain his inheritance which is ETERNITY.

Quote
PeaceTroll, do you believe in grace with out works? Do you believe that there is something that you do that saves you?
CHB

Good questions.

I believe in Grace first and foremost.  By Grace we are saved, this not of ourselves, but it is a GIFT FROM GOD.  NO man comes to Christ without the Fathers predestinating him/her.

What we must have to be saved is Christ in us and us IN Christ.  How do we know if we are IN Christ and not IN Darkness??  When we have faith in him (Again I could write a chapter on what faith in him is about, but I'll not do that now).



Dreamer

Quote
Peacetroll,

Are you saying dying for a god that would have unbelievers on their knees begging not be be roasted and obliterated is more worthy of your sacrifice and endurance than a God that would have those same people, now in the image of Christ, not on their knees begging for mercy, but on their knees thanking Him for His mercy?
Dreamer.

no one is getting roasted.  no one is gonna beg Jesus to not be obliterated.  No where does Christ say all will be in his image.  God will save all those who are of him.  The spirits who are not of him but are of Satan (Jesus told you about these but some don't hear him), will have all blame for all the rightouess blood ever shed on their shoulders, which is punishment by condemnation to the second death.

Jesus never jested or talked in vain, and did he not say the following??

Matthew 10:28
Do not be afraid of them who kill the body (Satan or tare-men). They are not able to kill the soul. But fear Him Who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell (In this he speaks of the True God of whom he is the express image).

Quote
We tend to pattern ourselves (or at least strive to) after the god we worship.
 

I agree.   But some people, scattered here and there have been given the truth metaphoric of being 'sealed'.  And we all must try our best to understand scripture, run the race and seek him.  For we should seek the Kingdom of God (Jesus) first and foremost.

Am I a man, of course.  Do I profess to know all scripture and prophecy?  Not by a looooooooooong shot.  I am prone to fallacy as much as most anyone.  Regardless I must try.  I am driven too.

Quote
You seem like a patient, somewhat gentle person -- in the sense that I've never seen you go off even in the midst of all the people here that disagree with you, so I'm puzzled as to why the god you've fashioned seem so different from you.

I wasnt' always as patient.  When I was a URist I use to get really mad, write things I regreted all the time and so on.  But since I realize who I am, and how I am a child of Light, I realize now I MUST try my very best to be patient, just and kind to all men, specially those who seek Christ.   My works should be a reflection of my faith to the best of my ability, but I fail every day, every hour.  Thank God Jesus Christ is my salvation and righteousness (if he be my Lord and I a lowest servant of the lowest servants).

Quote
I believe that Christ is the Savior of the world.  Why should that fact cause me not to endure?  Why would it cause our forebrothers not to endure?   


Because if you think all men are saved in the end, why would you be tortured and have your legs broke into 1000 pieces and your skin flayed as well as your childrens skulls crushed etc., when you know all you ahve to do is relax, shut up and not be controversial to the elite, and you would live.

If all men are saved, I don't think anyone would be highly motivated to preach the philosophy in the face of death.

Quote
Let me ask you -- what is your motivation for enduring?  Is it love for God and your wanting to please Him or is it just to save your hind particles?


So that perhaps one day I may be a floor scrubber in the House of the Lord, and all those in my house may be in Jesus' House as well as all those who ever were kind to me.  I run the  race not only for myself, but for my whole house, friends and even aquantenaces,....even this is not of my doing, but of the Lords.

Peace to all IN Christ.
 
 
« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 08:33:55 PM by Peacetroll »
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Offline Peacetroll

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2008, 08:11:08 PM »
God is not going to roast anyone who is on his knees begging for forgiveness. He is going to eliminate a cancer.

 Did you say Jesus BROKE the law and that's why they killed him?Where did you come up with that?   Is that why some of you ignore the words of truth given by Jesus while thinking you understand what Paul was teaching? :mblush:

Jesus fulfilled ALL of the laws and statutes, and that is why Paul preached grace, the grace of God to those who believe that Jesus was faultless and was raised from the dead because He WAS faultless. If this is not true then as Paul said,we are the most miserable of men.

What do the scriptures say?

Matthew 5:17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

 18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Exactly what He did.  Or all faith in Him is in vain.  As Jesus said to the evil jews who were out to get him for a fault.

John 8:45And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
 

46Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me?


 47He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

Because He was faultless, and by His grace, we in Him Jude said the following;

Jude 1:24Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy,

 25To the only wise God our Saviour, be glory and majesty, dominion and power, both now and ever. Amen.

Just as the prophets were killed mostly for exposing their evil works before Christ.

They killed Jesus because He was faultless and exposed their works as evil.






« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 08:25:50 PM by Peacetroll »
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Offline Kratos

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2008, 09:52:15 PM »
PT,

It seems that your question comes from the traditional view that salvation is a pass/fail prospect which teaches two distinct places (Heaven or Hell) and you are either in or out. This is not the way that UR believers see things so your question seems non-sensical from our perspective or eternal view of things.

We believe that God will eventually be All in All so everyone ends up at the same place. Heaven is just the realm of the Spirit where God rules His kingdom. The question is which road or which gate we will go through to arrive where we all end up and this distinction is worth preaching and warning and compelling and bearing reproach and bearing persecution for.

The narrow gate through faith in Jesus Christ while still in this life is so vastly superior to entering in through the wide gate through destruction that we gladly pledge our lives and our fortunes to warn others to choose the right gate. The wide gate will be entering the Kingdom by way of the Lake of Fire in which there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. It will indeed be horrible for anyone to enter this way and I would not want this for my worst enemy. 

It is only those who still see salvation as a pass/fail scenario that ask such questions as what difference does it make if people believe the gospel if all are saved anyway. Paul quoted Isaiah 45 in Phil. 2 and knew that every knee would bow and every tongue would confess and be saved. And yet, He also knew that it was worth dying to compel others to be reconciled to God now and avoid waiting for this day at the Great White Throne to make this confession. To use a natural example, why don't we blatantly kill people that we hate if we live in a state where there is no death penalty? For one thing, life in prison with no possibility of parole is still something to be avoided at all costs even though you will not die for your crime.

Only those who do not hear the gospel make light of the Lake of Fire just because it is not eternal torment.

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Moshood

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2008, 10:09:23 PM »
I'd rather die believing in the restoration of all then live believing in the damnation of any.


Offline Peacetroll

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2008, 10:38:43 PM »
Quote
The narrow gate through faith in Jesus Christ while still in this life is so vastly superior to entering in through the wide gate through destruction that we gladly pledge our lives and our fortunes to warn others to choose the right gate.
Kratos.

There is only way way to the Kingdom of God and that is through that narrow gate which is Christ.

The other gate you speak of does not lead to the Kingdom of God, but to destruction (which you mention but apparently are failing to comprehend). :dontknow:

I have shown you all that the Lake of Fire = The Second Death = Destruction.

Christ will be all in all once the tares are destroyed.  There is no place in the Kingdom of God for the tares.  They are 'burned' as you have been told by the very prophets you profess to believe, yet do not.

Isaiah 10:17-19 (New King James Version)
17 So the Light of Israel will be for a fire,
      And his Holy One for a flame;
      It will burn and devour
      His thorns and his briers in one day
.
       18 And it will consume the glory of his forest and of his fruitful field,
      Both soul and body;
      And they will be as when a sick man wastes away.
       19 Then the rest of the trees of his forest
      Will be so few in number
      That a child may write them.

Isaiah was speaking of the same event Jesus touched on below;

Matthew 3:12
Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

But who will listen to Jesus Christ over others???????  Who will believe the TRUTH over the lies of men????????

Matthew 13
 27So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?

 28He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?

 29But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.

 30Let both grow together until the harvest:(harvest = end of this earth age) and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

The metaphor is clear.  I'm sorta exasperated in trying to convey the metaphor to some of you, and I apologize if I'm abit tired at this point in time.

May God open many of your Eyes to the truth.

P.S. IF God were to destroy the spirits from Satan, why would that offend me?  IF I be a spirit from Satan, my destruction is well deserved and needful so that the remainder of the body may live in peace.  For the spirits of Satan have no place in the light.

What offense is it to me if the True God eliminates the 'bulls', 'vipers', 'wolves' and 'dragons', but saves the 'Men'????

None at all.



« Last Edit: January 24, 2008, 10:43:51 PM by Peacetroll »
Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Offline Reverend G

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2008, 10:51:48 PM »
Why not?  So,in effect, you are saying that those who follow UR would quickly renounce their faith in Him today, rather than face imprisonment, punishment, or death?  I don't think I believe that.  I guess I won't know personally unless it happens to me, but I like to believe that my faith would hold strong and that upholding my belief as a torch to others would be a bigger consideration than personal discomfort.
   This is similar to other claims non-UR people throw out, such as believing in UR allows me to live a sinful life without fear of recrimination later.  What doesn't follow is that while a denominational Christian I lived a much more sinful life than I do after finding UR, contrary to what they would expect.  He moves in us, and gives us great understanding.

Pleroo

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2008, 11:16:19 PM »
If Universal Salvation were true,

Why did the prophets and apostles put their lives and their loved one's lives in jeapardy every day? :dontknow:

It's counter-intuitive to place your family, your children and your friends lives in harms way when all shall be saved in the end regardless of their actions and beliefs. :mshock:

THINK.

PT, much of what Jesus told us was counter-intuitive.  Love your enemies, pray for them, forgive them, bless them, turn the other cheek, etc., etc.  Why, as Christians do we do those things?  Firstly, because He told us to, and secondly, because the Spirit of Christ is in us, empowering us, compelling us to.

So, why witness to the world, even in the face of persecution?  Because He tells us to and His Spirit empowers and compells us to.

Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations (Matt 28)...

And you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you and you will be witnesses to me ... to the ends of the earth.  (Acts 1)


Pleroo

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2008, 11:27:59 PM »
I was just thinking ... A more succinct way to put what I just posted is, "We love, because He first loved us."

Why risk sharing God's love with the world?  Because He loves us and He love us all.

Offline 97531

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2008, 11:53:22 PM »
What rebuttal?    What scriptural answer?

Every thread you start, there are rebuttals with scriptures.  You lose the argument, then simply start a new thread

Quote
Once again, I'm not necessarily asking you to think Seeker, for you would certainly oppose me if you could in the simple truth of  2 + 2 being 4 if you had the ability.

It appears you are the one with a deficiency in exercising acumen or logic.  You do not read rebuttals, hence the folk are getting sarcastic with you.  As for opposing you, I do not need to.  Any reader worth his salt will see you are a poor apologist.

You cannot have believed in UR and then try and run from the truth.  This is why you wrestle.  Have you noticed the forum is still growing?

If UR were untrue, as you infer, you are not doing a good job of converting/convincing us.

99% of us here are Christians, so what is your mission? More trolling than peace?
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Offline CHB

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Re: THINK.
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2008, 12:57:49 AM »
Quote from: PeaceTroll
.CHB

I don't think so.  First off URist have a tendency to be bashful when calling evil deeds evil and/or opposing evil men (their fruits being exposing who they are).

I think so. I have been on a few forums that were awful hostile and if I had been there in person speaking to these people they would probably have strangled me, I believe.

Quote from: PeaceTroll
The true prophets and apostles died because they hated evil, exposed it and pointed their finger at the rich and greedy of the world and said 'you vipers, how shall you escape the damnation of hell??'.

They preached against the law.

Quote from: PeaceTroll
I don't believe for one second that the rich and elite of John the baptists days could care less about what he actually believed.  Herod had John killed (or allowed it), because of his INFLUENCE on others and indirectly his influence on Herod and the Pharisee's money machine.

The law was the main theme of that day and any one found breaking the least one was punished severely. You should know this.


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Paul preached grace, not law, Jesus broke the law that is why they killed him. We who believe in the salvation of all preach grace without works. 
CHB

Quote from: PeaceTroll
Paul did preace grace, and mercy and predestination too.  Jesus broke the law????????????????????????  That's why they killed him???????????????

I could write a whole chapter on that, but I'm not gonna.  The 'earthy' reason Jesus died was because he harmed the Pharisee's money making scheme in the Temple.  The 'spiritual' reason was because the principalities of the air way thought he was the heir and they could kill him and gain his inheritance which is ETERNITY.

What did Jesus talk about? Law. They also killed him because he said he was the Son of God.


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PeaceTroll, do you believe in grace with out works? Do you believe that there is something that you do that saves you?
CHB

Quote from: PeaceTroll

Good questions.

I believe in Grace first and foremost.  By Grace we are saved, this not of ourselves, but it is a GIFT FROM GOD.  NO man comes to Christ without the Fathers predestinating him/her.

What we must have to be saved is Christ in us and us IN Christ.  How do we know if we are IN Christ and not IN Darkness??  When we have faith in him (Again I could write a chapter on what faith in him is about, but I'll not do that now).

PeaceTroll,

You just said. "by grace we are saved,  the faith we have is a gift from God" and this is true. Then you said, "we know Christ is in us, when we have faith in him". 

Grace is a free gift, right, so is faith? We do not have to do any thing to get grace or faith. What does grace and faith lead to, salvation, right? Salvation is a free gift to all mankind. We don't have to work for our grace or faith, then how do we lose our salvation? Doesn't make any sense does it?

You said the "lake of fire and the second death were destruction", this is true, it is the destruction of sin, not people. The lake of fire and the second death are both spiritual, they are not literal.

(1Cor. 3:15) If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss, but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

It is the works that are burned and this is the second death.

CHB